Another Membership Success

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
Sean Hewitt
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Another Membership Success

Post by Sean Hewitt » Mon Apr 29, 2013 8:31 pm

The South East Lancashire Summer League have voted to have all 4 divisions of their competition graded this year. I understand this is the first time ever that they have done this. They quoted the abolition of game fee and its replacement with membership as the reason for this paradigm shift.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Another Membership Success

Post by Roger de Coverly » Mon Apr 29, 2013 8:41 pm

Sean Hewitt wrote: They quoted the abolition of game fee and its replacement with membership as the reason for this paradigm shift.
If they don't have any players exclusively playing in that league, presumably they found £ 3 per board under the old Game Fee rules too expensive. If all their players are members already, the additional cost is zero, if any aren't or are new to chess, the cost is £ 2 per game. Presumably as it's Manchester, they are technically Midlands, otherwise they could have joined the NCCU membership scheme years ago.

Anyway, we know this is the "Membership is always cheaper than Game Fee argument" which is totally false as witnessed by the furore about junior players.

LawrenceCooper
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Re: Another Membership Success

Post by LawrenceCooper » Mon Apr 29, 2013 9:33 pm

I knew that Roger would be the first to pass on his congratulations :lol:

Mick Norris
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Re: Another Membership Success

Post by Mick Norris » Mon Apr 29, 2013 9:33 pm

Sean Hewitt wrote:The South East Lancashire Summer League have voted to have all 4 divisions of their competition graded this year. I understand this is the first time ever that they have done this. They quoted the abolition of game fee and its replacement with membership as the reason for this paradigm shift.
Nice to know they followed my suggestion :wink:
Any postings on here represent my personal views and should not be taken as representative of the Manchester Chess Federation www.manchesterchess.co.uk

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Another Membership Success

Post by Roger de Coverly » Mon Apr 29, 2013 9:43 pm

Mick Norris wrote: Nice to know they followed my suggestion
So what was their problem with having it graded under the previous Game Fee rules? It's only five or six games from what I can see, so was the cost per board of around £ 1 (game fee at 20p) rising over the years to around £ 3 ( game fee at 60p) considered totally unaffordable?

Richard Bates
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Re: Another Membership Success

Post by Richard Bates » Mon Apr 29, 2013 10:07 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Mick Norris wrote: Nice to know they followed my suggestion
So what was their problem with having it graded under the previous Game Fee rules? It's only five or six games from what I can see, so was the cost per board of around £ 1 (game fee at 20p) rising over the years to around £ 3 ( game fee at 60p) considered totally unaffordable?
Maybe because the cost now falls mainly on the players (for whom membership is an insignificant sum) rather than the league (for which it was not)?

Or perhaps they are also considering the revolutionary perspective that a significant number of players in their league don't restrict themselves to only playing graded chess in that league?

Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Another Membership Success

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Tue Apr 30, 2013 8:03 am

"They quoted the abolition of game fee and its replacement with membership as the reason for this paradigm shift."

Did they actually say that, or are you starting a "Bullsh*t Bingo" competition?

Alan Walton
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Re: Another Membership Success

Post by Alan Walton » Tue Apr 30, 2013 9:22 am

From what I remember the Summer League stop grading its games a couple of years after the Game Fee came into effect, because it was too expensive for the league and required significantly more administrative work to invoice the clubs

With the overwhelming majority of Manchester players being members then it is a no brainer to start grading it again

And for me I will start playing in it again now it is being graded

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Another Membership Success

Post by Roger de Coverly » Tue Apr 30, 2013 9:31 am

Alan Walton wrote:because it was too expensive for the league and required significantly more administrative work to invoice the clubs
Presumably the league didn't charge an entry fee.

It was always the simple approach to have an entry fee per club and team. Add up all the expenses of the local association including Game Fee and charge an entry fee to cover them. Provided you are prepared to carry a surplus or deficit from one year to the next, the exact amount of Game Fee doesn't matter. Ironically unless they ban non-members from participation, they will get a bill for £ 2 per game per non-member from the ECF for which presumably they will have to invoice the clubs.

Mick Norris
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Re: Another Membership Success

Post by Mick Norris » Tue Apr 30, 2013 9:43 am

Alan Walton wrote:From what I remember the Summer League stop grading its games a couple of years after the Game Fee came into effect, because it was too expensive for the league and required significantly more administrative work to invoice the clubs

With the overwhelming majority of Manchester players being members then it is a no brainer to start grading it again

And for me I will start playing in it again now it is being graded
And there is a club from Lancashire that now wish to join :shock:
Any postings on here represent my personal views and should not be taken as representative of the Manchester Chess Federation www.manchesterchess.co.uk

Sean Hewitt
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Re: Another Membership Success

Post by Sean Hewitt » Tue Apr 30, 2013 10:33 am

Kevin Thurlow wrote:"They quoted the abolition of game fee and its replacement with membership as the reason for this paradigm shift."

Did they actually say that, or are you starting a "Bullsh*t Bingo" competition?
What they actually said was "Because everyone is already a member, we don't have to pay to have the games graded. So we can get an extra 7 graded games for free".

I expect that this league will now start to grow as other clubs enter, and existing clubs enter more teams. To those of us who have witnessed the growth in participation that membership brings (as it did in Leicestershire), this is no surprise.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Another Membership Success

Post by Roger de Coverly » Tue Apr 30, 2013 10:42 am

Sean Hewitt wrote: To those of us who have witnessed the growth in participation that membership brings (as it did in Leicestershire), this is no surprise.
It's not participation as in new players, but participation as in more games. In the London and South East with overlapping leagues and clubs, that demand is satisfied by playing for another club in a different league. If players are happy with one game a month or one game every two weeks, it doesn't matter how many extra games you offer if they have already reached their participation level. So the presumed Leicester experience with the local league having a monopoly doesn't translate to the rest of the country.

Summer leagues don't enjoy any great popularity in London and the South East and aren't free if you have to incur additional premises hire in order to take part. League players take a break from chess over the summer, or if they play at all, take part in Congresses.

MartinCarpenter
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Re: Another Membership Success

Post by MartinCarpenter » Tue Apr 30, 2013 10:58 am

I was actually always relatively glad that this wasn't graded because I can't take chess at all seriously over the summer :) (Not that I played all that often anyway.).

Well you could argue that there are already a few clubs from Lancashire involved ;) (Not that its at all obvious which side of the historic boundaries Chorlton/Stockport would fall.).

William Metcalfe
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Re: Another Membership Success

Post by William Metcalfe » Tue Apr 30, 2013 10:59 am

I was talking to a local player last night he has spent the Winter in France it has mandatory membership at a cost of 100 euros then it costs 50 Euros to join a club i guess Roger would emigrate from France if he lived there or he would not play any chess lol
I am speaking here for myself and not the NCCU which i am now president of

Michael Bennett
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Re: Another Membership Success

Post by Michael Bennett » Tue Apr 30, 2013 11:03 am

Roger de Coverly wrote:Summer leagues don't enjoy any great popularity in London and the South East... League players take a break from chess over the summer, or if they play at all, take part in Congresses.
Not true for London. The City of London Rapidplay League, started 4 years ago, runs June - August and is very popular.
Michael Bennett
Hendon Chess Club: http://www.hendonchessclub.com
Golders Green Rapidplays: http://www.goldersgreenchess.blogspot.com

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