Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
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Ben Purton
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Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by Ben Purton » Sun Dec 21, 2008 5:41 pm

Im getting over excited as its nearing 6PM GMT, on sunday. Which means NFL time, mindless violence with tactics, Its beautiful
I love sleep, I need 8 hours a day and about 10 at night - Bill Hicks
I would die happy if I beat Wood Green in the Eastman Cup final - Richmond LL captain.
Hating the Yankees since 2002. Hating the Jets since 2001.

Mick Norris
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Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by Mick Norris » Sun Dec 21, 2008 6:22 pm

Sean Hewitt wrote:
Mick Norris wrote: So, can we leave out the personal stuff and actually put together a plan to do this?
It's pretty simple - someone needs to stand against him at the next AGM. He was elected unopposed this year and last. In 2006 someone stood against him as President, and someone else as FIDE delegate. Both those opponents were defeated by GW in the election.
My point being that a plan is needed to stop the block vote re-electing GW (OK, you actually need people to stand against him, too)
Any postings on here represent my personal views and should not be taken as representative of the Manchester Chess Federation www.manchesterchess.co.uk

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Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by Paul McKeown » Sun Dec 21, 2008 6:59 pm

I expressed the desire to play for the country of which I am (and presumably you are) a citizen. Is there something inherently unreasonable about this? Why, exactly, should this be "drivel"?
I give full credit to Gerry Walsh for his pivotal role in the 1972 Teeside tournament. Perhaps it is not insignificant, however, that this event took place as many as 36 years ago. As can be seen from the correspondence in the Atticus forum, The President of the ECF only responded to an e-mail, addressed directly to him from the most senior member of the England chess team, and of legitimate interest to all English chess players, after a delay of several days and being prompted to do so by Stewart Reuben. His reply - in essence, "none of my business" is grossly irresponsible , but unfortunately very typical.
The implication is, of course, that the words of NS are intemperate, ill thought out and unreasonable. I am very well aware that FIDE regulations cannot be changed at the drop of a hat. However the ECF delegate, who holds a position analogous to that of an MP, can put forward legislation. David Anderton did so very effectively when he was our representative. There is no indication that Gerry Walsh has ever even thought about any of the issues that affect international chess, let alone done anything about them (please name a single proposal of his) during his long tenure as ECF Delegate. For example, how did he vote on the proposed changes to the FIDE Grand Prix from which our leading player, Michael Adams, has now withdrawn, in disgust? How did Gerry Walsh vote on the changes to the time control which has rendered the civilised tempo of the EU Championship in Liverpool and the Gibraltar tournaments illegal? Did he make a speech in defence of our practices? Do we have a clue? Well, we don't know, because Gerry Walsh doesn't answer to anyone.
Furthermore, the instransigence or corruptness of FIDE is no excuse. The ECF is quite capable of introducing its own regulations for eligilibility for the English team.
Just like Luke McShane and Matthew Sadler, who have made their decisions to work elsewhere, for Goldman Sachs and Hewlitt Packard respectively, primarily on economic grounds, Michael Adams and myself have done the same with the British Championship. We judge (rightly or wrongly) that it is usually not worth our while, which is why I have only appeared at event once in the last 20 years. I would suggest that the repeated failure to attract England's leading players to the national championship is a damning indictment of the state of British chess. Perhaps you would rather have me abandon chess become a lawyer, like my brother? I will leave others to judge whether that would be in the interests of the game in this country.
I believe that I already mentioned that Ingrid lauterbach informed me herself that she has not lived in the UK for the last 7 years. Far from being "uninformed (and perhaps erroneous) speculation" I suspect that, on the contrary, I am very well informed.
Greetings Grandmaster Short! May I first say that I and I'm sure everyone else on this forum are delighted to hear from such august company as yourself. I hope you and yours are well; I'm sure you're being treated to better weather than we are here! Secondly, let me say that I'm not sure I will be able to deal with all of your points here; I'm doing this whilst bashing spuds, rolling streaky round pork sausages to make pigs in blankets and stuffing a turkey. So accept my apologies if I can't give you a response to all your points immediately.

Onto substantive matters
1. I'm pleased (actually thrilled would be more apposite) that you actually care. I'm sure you could make a decent living from chess without worrying a fig about the status of chess in England, or more widely in Britain. And if you care sufficiently, then your reputation can alone carry great weight in arguments for change.
2. Calling GW demeaning names in public - I don't like it. However, if I have read the correspondence correctly, then you used the, by now, well known epithet in private correspondence with SR. Then you made it clear to SR that he could let GW know that's what you thought of him. That's fine - he does appear to be hard of hearing these days, or to have a tremendously thick hide - and clear language probably needs to be spoken to him - but in private. It was Dave Robertson, however, that made your private correspondence public. I wish, in that case, that he had quietly removed the strong language. I think it would be unfair on GW to go through the remainder of his life with people sniggering behind his back about him being "a useless tub of lard." Sadly, that is now likely to happen.
3. I agree with you, however, that GW does need to go. It is, as you point out, 36 years since Teeside 1972. And no one can think of bugger all useful he's done for English chess since 1990, at the very least.
4. Your "drivel" on the Chessbase website was called such by me, because you seemed to want to suppress the natural love of the Scots and Welsh, etc. for their patria. I don't think it unreasonable that they should have separate chess federations. They have separate football and rugby teams, as well. Why should they want to lose their identities in a homogenous GB or UK team? Sometimes, when reading your writings, I get the feeling of listening to someone even more English than Churchill's bulldog. Which is fine, as it's rather funny at times, which is I'm sure the mark of a good writer - and Chessbase does take a rather tabloid approach to chess news sometimes. Just sometimes maybe it can overshoot the mark.

Got to go now - I'll be back in half an hour or so - brussels sprouts need attending too...

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Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by Paul McKeown » Sun Dec 21, 2008 7:34 pm

Nigel, To be fair, I rather doubt I'm going to be able to respond to all your points this evening. I'll try tomorrow. And thanks for visiting. I'll be in touch. Paul.

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Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by Nigel Short » Sun Dec 21, 2008 8:02 pm

In answer to Paul McKeown:

"you seemed to want to suppress the natural love of the Scots and Welsh, etc. for their patria. I don't think it unreasonable that they should have separate chess federations."

I understand perfectly well that some Scots, Welsh etc. desire to have separate chess federations, just as I understand that some Basques, Catalans, Quebecois, Tamils, Tatars, Texans, Ossetians, Chechens etc. may wish to represent their various territories. Their aspirations however, should not impinge upon the legitimate right of others who wish to play for the nation of which they are, in fact, citizens - in my case, the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. You can argue as much as you want for British exceptionalism, that somehow our island nation deserves to be treated differently from (almost) all other nations: we will not agree on that. However to dismiss my logical point as "drivel" is just plain rude. But then again, you probably didn't expect me to reply on this forum, did you?
As to my remarks about Gerry Walsh: I will frankly admit that some of them are very harsh and of a personal nature. But as you have rightly observed he is either very deaf or has an extremely thick hide (both, in my opinion) and simply does not respond adequately, if at all, to polite enquiry or reasoned argument. My words are an outpouring of years of pent-up frustration. This ignorant, inert blob of a delegate - a junket-junkie par excellence - has served nobody's interests but his own for way too many years now. When addressing this worthless individual - a total disgrace to English chess- I can do no better than echo the stirring words of Oliver Cromwell to the rump parliament:
"You have sat too long for any good you have been doing lately ... Depart, I say; and let us have done with you. In the name of God, go!"
Last edited by Nigel Short on Sun Dec 21, 2008 8:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Mark Howitt
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Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by Mark Howitt » Sun Dec 21, 2008 8:06 pm

Nigel, great to see that you care and are willing to speak your mind. And it's about time that the ECF had someone who stood up for the English players who pay for it.

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Carl Hibbard
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Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by Carl Hibbard » Sun Dec 21, 2008 8:10 pm

This whilst amusing is getting beyond a joke on the personal name calling - if there is a point then please people make it but try to keep the abuse down a little and save me some hassle

I don't want to start moderating just to cut the silly names out!

:roll:
Cheers
Carl Hibbard

Nigel Short
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Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by Nigel Short » Sun Dec 21, 2008 8:19 pm

I will agree that the word "blob" is unkind. The rest is fair critcism.

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Carl Hibbard
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Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by Carl Hibbard » Sun Dec 21, 2008 8:22 pm

Nigel Short wrote:I will agree that the word "blob" is unkind. The rest is fair criticism.
The criticism is fair and you can make your point as strongly as you desire but the name calling isn't acceptable and needs to be toned down
Cheers
Carl Hibbard

andrew martin

Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by andrew martin » Sun Dec 21, 2008 8:26 pm

Everyone has the right to his own dignity

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=spz8_rpE0e0

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Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by Carl Hibbard » Sun Dec 21, 2008 8:51 pm

Ernie Lazenby wrote:
Carl Hibbard wrote:
Nigel Short wrote:I will agree that the word "blob" is unkind. The rest is fair criticism.
The criticism is fair and you can make your point as strongly as you desire but the name calling isn't acceptable and needs to be toned down
I would have thought that calling him a tub of lard and referring to his mother is also way over the line. Hope Carl keeps the personal stuff out of this.
Ernie that "quote" started in an email and was published on the Atticus forum and then cross posted to here but naturally I will try to keep the personal comments to a minumum
Cheers
Carl Hibbard

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Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by Nigel Short » Sun Dec 21, 2008 9:02 pm

For those not familiar with the "tub of lard" reference in English popular culture, please see http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=xEmafBMlDiE
As to my remark about Gerry swanning everywhere with his mother in tow, it is relevant in that it pertains to the brazen disregard with which he treats his duties as ECF Delegate.

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Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by Steve Henderson » Sun Dec 21, 2008 9:12 pm

Nigel Short wrote: As to my remark about Gerry swanning everywhere with his mother in tow, it is relevant in that it pertains to the brazen disregard with which he treats his duties as ECF Delegate.
Nigel, can you expand a bit further to the remark you have made?
I don't understand what difference it makes if you have your mother with you or not?

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Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by David Robertson » Sun Dec 21, 2008 9:45 pm

As ever, people drive to the heart of the matter :roll:

Small wonder Gerry Walsh survives. He will until people focus their attention on his performance as ECF President & FIDE delegate. That's all that matters, not the textual deconstruction of Nigel's polemic. Get real, won't you. Address the real matter in hand.

David
Atticus CC

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Re: Nigel Short wishes Gerry Walsh 'Merry Xmas & Begone!'

Post by benedgell » Sun Dec 21, 2008 10:10 pm

http://www.englishchess.org.uk/organisa ... lities.htm

"The responsibilites of the President....acts as a focal point for the concerns of members and chess players generally" :lol:

Also, and possibly I'm being a bit simple here, but if some of the people posting are as unhappy with Gerry Walsh's presidency as they claim, why dont they run against him? I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure there was only one person who stood for election as president at the last AGM.

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