Annual General Meeting 2013

[Ken Norman]

So why not include an under 18 in the women's team and ask the Trust for the £4k? Maybe twisting the rules but not sending a team just doesn't seem right to me, especially for as little as £4k, when I guess the Open team has appearance fees.

If there is a shortfall of £4,000 why can’t the players make up the difference?

Assuming a team of 5 women players that is only £800 each.

This has been done in the past.

A friend of mine who played for England in the Olympiad, The Clare Benedict tournament and the Anglo-Dutch matches during the 1960’s Mentioned to me recently that when selected by the BCF the players were ask to sign an agreement that if required they would pay part of the costs of the team.

Are you talking about the men or the women, Ken, because the 4,000 shortfall which is attributed to the womens' team is really the shortfall in sponsoring the full cost of the mens' team.

Jonathan,

Obviously the men’s team should also make a contribution to cutting the deficit.

The men’s team should refuse to accept any appearance fee’s from ECF funds.

[Jonathan Rogers]

Thanks for clarifying, Ken. As you will realise, this is not so obvious to many people.

[Ken Norman]

A friend of mine who played for England in the Olympiad, The Clare Benedict tournament and the Anglo-Dutch matches during the 1960’s Mentioned to me recently that when selected by the BCF the players were ask to sign an agreement that if required they would pay part of the costs of the team.

Is it not recorded that when John Littlewood first played in the Hastings Premier in the early 1960s, the invitation didn't extend to paying his hotel bill? From the early seventies, sponsorship and similar income became abundant, which built
expectations for players to become professionals or semi-professionals.

I have also been told by English Players who played in the Premier in the 1960’s that only the Foreign players received financial support.

I expect Leonard Barden would be able to confirm.

[William Metcalfe]

Those figures came from the International manager Jonathan

[Martin Regan]

Rdc:

The Martin Regan Board was apt to boast that the ECF was worth a million in assets.

Nope. We simply pointed out that the ECF had a million in assets and in order to save tax, and with little thought of the longterm consequences, had put it out of its own reach.

[Jonathan Rogers]

Those figures came from the International manager Jonathan

I know!

Where did he get them from? They don't sound right to me (I can explain, but really, do they sound likely to anyone?) and I'd be curious to know what the relevant figures for 2011 were.

[Gerry_Jepps]

I think the figures given were £24k and £9k, and that both of those figures were for teams of 5 plus a captain

Does that mean that we are paying Adams et al roughly £15k to represent us? (assuming our women's team don't get appearance fees?). I realise it doesn't seem to be the prevalent view but to me this is just wrong - people should absolutely NOT be getting paid for the honour of representing their country.

Different if there's TV money or sponsors - but there isn't in chess, so the limited funds of the ECF should be directed at grass roots/juniors and you'd hope that those who have benefitted from the infrastructure put in place would recognise this and represent their country willingly, given someone else is picking-up the tab for their holiday.

Paul

Paul, where did you get this quote from? It's not something I said.

Gerry

[William Metcalfe]

I do not know where the figure came from but it sounds wrong to me also.We really need to find out how much money was spent on previous womens teams

[Jonathan Rogers]

Quite. I mean, when you realise that professional fees and other extras are for sponsors to pay, and that even food and drink does not need to be fully covered by the ECF (after all, people would still eat and drink even if they weren't playing for England: and again, sponsors or players can pay for such things as post-game drinks) then the main costs for the ECF to pay is six plane tickets (five players and one coach) plus, say four Hotel rooms (because the women are prepared to share rooms, and have regularly done so in the past) for ten days. How does that come close to £9K?

(Edit: Perhaps bare costs should extend to a small fee for the women's coach too: he would have to work hard and "he" might well be stronger than the players themselves. But again the fee should ideally be topped up by sponsorship).

[William Metcalfe]

I have just been on the phone to somebody who has been involved in the past with English teams and they are shocked at the 9k figure for the womens team

[Roger de Coverly]

last time I looked at the 2013-14 budget the figures were: International chess 31%, Membership scheme, admin and contingency 64%, grading 5%.

The International figure is artificially high, arising from the need to finance both the Europeans (Nov 2013) and the Olympiad (Aug 2014) in the same ECF financial year. That in turn would have caused by the shift of the ECF's financial year from being 1st May to 30th April to being 1st September to 31st August. Whilst it be highly unusual for the Euros not to be in the Autumn, the Olympiad can and does wander around the calendar. Examples of it being early were Turin in 2006 and Tromso next year.

The more normal figure is around 10%-20%. It's the Euros that can be more expensive, as teams have to pay for their own food and accommodation. It's one reason why the Scots, Welsh and Irish are only ever somewhere near full strength for the Olympiads.

[Roger de Coverly]

The argument has not been mentioned before?

There was an immensely vague rumour, which may have conflated itself with the story of the Director who didn't walk out. Perhaps something like X had a row with Y over the issue Z, without it ever being posted as to who X and Y were and what Z was about.

Those at the meeting now report disclosure of the identities of X and Y, without recording the issue Z, if there even was one.

[Mick Norris]

Are you sure that you are not at the Euston Square Hotel hiding in one of the alcoves, Mick? I suspect that proceedings here may have been more enjoyable than the Bury v Morecambe game.

There is now a vacancy at Gigg Lane following the sacking of Manager Kevin Blackwell - listening to his excuses has been much like listening to some chess players

[Roger de Coverly]

The first of the reports from attendees has now appeared from the Bristol and South West delegate.

http://www.chessit.co.uk/phpforum/viewt ... ?f=6&t=275

[Mick Norris]

Interesting, that's the third Report I have read, and they are all quite different