Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
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Joshua Gibbs
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Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by Joshua Gibbs » Tue Sep 13, 2016 11:15 pm

Hi am i right in thinking there is no code of conduct laid out for conduct by chess players by the ECF?

my point is as follows:

For myself telling someone to f**k off would be a totally acceptable way of telling them not to look at my board, but many would find swearing inappropriate.

how would clubs take action if there is no guidelines
Chess, translation, dealing with the police, programming and almost getting killed or arrested: http://honyakujoshua.blogspot.co.uk/

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by Roger de Coverly » Tue Sep 13, 2016 11:53 pm

Joshua Gibbs wrote: For myself telling someone to f**k off would be a totally acceptable way of telling them not to look at my board, but many would find swearing inappropriate.
As a general principle, spectators are allowed as long as they don't interfere with the game in progress. That might be interpreted as keeping their distance.

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Joshua Gibbs
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Re: Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by Joshua Gibbs » Wed Sep 14, 2016 12:16 am

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Joshua Gibbs wrote: For myself telling someone to f**k off would be a totally acceptable way of telling them not to look at my board, but many would find swearing inappropriate.
As a general principle, spectators are allowed as long as they don't interfere with the game in progress. That might be interpreted as keeping their distance.
I was using it as a case in point, i dont mind people looking at my boards, but remember one incident like this.... who decides what is acceptable?
Chess, translation, dealing with the police, programming and almost getting killed or arrested: http://honyakujoshua.blogspot.co.uk/

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by Roger de Coverly » Wed Sep 14, 2016 12:20 am

Joshua Gibbs wrote: I was using it as a case in point, i dont mind people looking at my boards, but remember one incident like this.... who decides what is acceptable?
Local clubs and leagues. Attempts by the ECF to dictate inappropriate standards would be met with two fingers.

Michael Flatt
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Re: Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by Michael Flatt » Wed Sep 14, 2016 9:44 am

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Joshua Gibbs wrote: I was using it as a case in point, i dont mind people looking at my boards, but remember one incident like this.... who decides what is acceptable?
Local clubs and leagues. Attempts by the ECF to dictate inappropriate standards would be met with two fingers.
As RdC suggests it would be best to raise your concerns with the Arbiter or organisers of that particular event.

In a team event, even the captain (and club secretary) might find one of his own player's conduct unacceptable or sufficiently embarrassing to issue a warning, drop the player from the team or, in extreme cases, dismiss him or her from the club.

Roger Lancaster
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Re: Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by Roger Lancaster » Wed Sep 14, 2016 4:16 pm

Yes, as Roger and Michael suggest above, "acceptable behaviour" is just as subjective a concept at chess events as in life generally. So it's down to the local organiser or equivalent and, what one might find acceptable, another might not.

John Moore
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Re: Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by John Moore » Wed Sep 14, 2016 6:01 pm

Joshua Gibbs wrote:Hi am i right in thinking there is no code of conduct laid out for conduct by chess players by the ECF?

my point is as follows:

For myself telling someone to f**k off would be a totally acceptable way of telling them not to look at my board, but many would find swearing inappropriate.

how would clubs take action if there is no guidelines
Joshua - what you might find as acceptable is clearly what 99% of people on this Forum would not find so. Indeed, I am aware of some players who would not be checking the ECF code of conduct had you acted in that way. In any event, I thought that you were saying that you only played online chess so what point are you trying to make.

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Joshua Gibbs
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Re: Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by Joshua Gibbs » Wed Sep 14, 2016 7:56 pm

John Moore wrote:
Joshua - what you might find as acceptable is clearly what 99% of people on this Forum would not find so. Indeed, I am aware of some players who would not be checking the ECF code of conduct had you acted in that way. In any event, I thought that you were saying that you only played online chess so what point are you trying to make.
I do play league chess.

The point I am tryng to make is there should be some form of objective set of rules for how players should behave laid out by the association they play in so people dont argue and get upset when they perceive unfair treatment.

I have heard of people doing things that havent been disciplined and have seen people been disciplined for things that I deem less bad.

Several players I know have told me they thing it is really unfair, and I agree and think chess groups should have an objective set of rules.
Chess, translation, dealing with the police, programming and almost getting killed or arrested: http://honyakujoshua.blogspot.co.uk/

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JustinHorton
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Re: Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by JustinHorton » Wed Sep 14, 2016 8:00 pm

Have you anywhere in particular in mind? (He asked, suspiciously.)
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

lostontime.blogspot.com

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Joshua Gibbs
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Re: Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by Joshua Gibbs » Wed Sep 14, 2016 8:03 pm

JustinHorton wrote:Have you anywhere in particular in mind? (He asked, suspiciously.)

nowhere, no. I think it is an issue with most of the clubs ive played at...
Chess, translation, dealing with the police, programming and almost getting killed or arrested: http://honyakujoshua.blogspot.co.uk/

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Carl Hibbard
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Re: Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by Carl Hibbard » Wed Sep 14, 2016 8:26 pm

Here I am again.
Cheers
Carl Hibbard

Nick Grey
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Re: Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by Nick Grey » Wed Sep 14, 2016 10:00 pm

SCCA (Surrey) changed their rules a few years ago. It was clear that previously the rules before only allowed this process for members, club officials etc.

I seconded the proposal because the year before it was one of our players that caused the dispute.
Our club also made a decision for a long term ban. Conduct was completely unacceptable.

This may have been the last dispute that in the first instance has to go to our Chess disputes committee. Our board have been brilliant in having to make these rules.

The whole matter was detrimental to all the players in both clubs. I have been fortunate in speaking to those effected. They are my friends.

If you were playing in a competition at our club we would report you.

Of course even if visiting/playing on our premises we would probably kick you out, your conduct is unacceptable.

I do not think you are helping yourself in your posts.

Anyway, you can find this on the first link of our Administration page.


2.10 Exclusion of players
2.10.1 A player may be excluded from any or all of the Company’s competitions if, in the opinion of the Board, he has acted or has threatened to act in a manner which is substantially contrary to the interests of the Company as a whole or if his conduct (whether as a player or otherwise) is likely to bring the Company, or any or all of its Directors or Members into disrepute.
2.10.2 If at a meeting of the Board a resolution is passed to exclude a player, the Board must serve a notice on the player that the Board has resolved to invoke the provisions of these rules and giving a statement of the reasons for the Board's decision.
2.10.3 The notice to the player must also give the player the opportunity to make representations to the Board in writing or in person as to why he should not be excluded. The Board must consider any representations made by the player and, if the representations are not made by the player at a Board meeting, the Board must consider the representations at the next Board meeting.
2.10.4 After the Board meeting at which the representations are considered, the Board must serve a notice on the player informing him of the decision.
2.10.5 If the decision is to exclude the player, the exclusion must be notified as soon as reasonably practicable to the Controllers of all competitions to which the exclusion applies and, in the case of a Club Competition to the secretary of any Club for which the player would otherwise have been eligible.
2.10.6 There will be no right of appeal a decision of the Board to exclude a player.
2.10.7 The Board's proceedings and the statement of reasons for exclusion will be confidential. Save for notification pursuant to Bye Law 2.10.5 above, the Board must make no statement concerning the player’s exclusion unless the player himself chooses to make public the issue of his exclusion, or to make it a matter of interest to the Members as a whole.

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Joshua Gibbs
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Re: Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by Joshua Gibbs » Wed Sep 14, 2016 10:29 pm

Nick Grey wrote:
If you were playing in a competition at our club we would report you.

Of course even if visiting/playing on our premises we would probably kick you out, your conduct is unacceptable.


agan this shows me why an objective standard is needed.
Chess, translation, dealing with the police, programming and almost getting killed or arrested: http://honyakujoshua.blogspot.co.uk/

Mike Truran
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Re: Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by Mike Truran » Wed Sep 14, 2016 10:41 pm

Sorry Joshua - telling someone to f**k off if they dare to look at your game doesn't require an objective standard. It's just well out of order.

Nick Grey
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Re: Is there any code of conduct for the Players laid out by the ECF?

Post by Nick Grey » Wed Sep 14, 2016 10:48 pm

It is not acceptable to swear. I'm amazed that you have not got another ban. Really Carl has warned you.

I suspect if you were playing football you would have hundreds of yellow and reds and fines and bans attached and enormous expenses before you would learn.

I will ignore you until you say something outrageous again.

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