Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
Ian Thompson
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Ian Thompson » Tue Feb 14, 2017 10:17 pm

Alan Atkinson wrote:However, I do worry that in this Brave New system there are so very few Arbiter Assessors: I set out to be an arbiter because of the changes in the pipeline which would adversely affect chess in Thanet and East Kent generally. Now we will have to get Assessors to come along here if we want any more arbiters. Have any of them been to any Congresses in East Kent since the British was held in Canterbury in 2010? I doubt it, but would be happy to be proved wrong.
I don't know whether it still happens or not, but David Welch turned up at the West of England Championship in Exmouth a few years ago just to check up on the standard of arbiting, I believe. That's rather further out of the way than Thanet is. It's just a pity that he turned up on the 2nd and 3rd days, and not the 1st day, when he could have seen some grossly incompetent arbiting, or the last day, when he could have observed some very poor organisation.

E Michael White
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by E Michael White » Tue Feb 14, 2017 10:50 pm

Ian Thompson wrote:I don't know whether it still happens or not, but David Welch turned up at the West of England Championship in Exmouth a few years ago just to check up on the standard of arbiting, I believe. That's rather further out of the way than Thanet is. It's just a pity that he turned up on the 2nd and 3rd days, and not the 1st day, when he could have seen some grossly incompetent arbiting, or the last day, when he could have observed some very poor organisation.
Exmouth scored about average then ?

Michael Flatt
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Michael Flatt » Wed Feb 15, 2017 12:25 pm

Alan Atkinson wrote:My Level 2 Arbiter Level status was removed quite deliberately: however, if I was to ask Alex H nicely, he could write up the 4NCL Individual Rapidplay and the 4NCL Team Rapidplay events that I assisted at in 2016 and then if two out of Alex, Laura B and Geoff G were to agree, I might apply to get my Level 2 status reinstated.

I am hopeful of becoming a FA soon, so that takes me to Level 3 so there should, all being well, be no need to trouble them.
Sorry to learn about the hiccup in your listing. It was your own success in making the list that encouraged me to make one last effort myself.

I don't think that the process was intended to be an endurance test but that's what it seems to have become.

Despite the change in the regulations getting made up to full ECF Arbiter (Level 2) is still reliant on the good will of a small group of individuals, the ECF Senior Arbiters. The only change being that they are now called Assessors and a strict set of assessment criteria introduced.

Will it encourage any others to get official recognition for what they already do in controlling tournaments? I doubt it.

Alan Atkinson
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Alan Atkinson » Wed Feb 15, 2017 10:30 pm

Micheal Flatt wrote:
Despite the change in the regulations getting made up to full ECF Arbiter (Level 2) is still reliant on the good will of a small group of individuals, the ECF Senior Arbiters. The only change being that they are now called Assessors and a strict set of assessment criteria introduced.

Will it encourage any others to get official recognition for what they already do in controlling tournaments? I doubt it.
There does have to be a cadre of Arbiter Assessors willing to get out to the various events to make those assessments: the present bunch are all very nice people, but they are often at the same events all together, and doing the 'Arbiter norm' qualifying events.

If they spend all their volunteer hours ensuring that the prestige events are run properly, then it is difficult to fault them.
As I said, we do want the events to run properly.
However, others will need to be offered those same arbiter-experience slots to progress up the scales, and each weekend the senior arbiters run an event is a time slot they are not able to do an assessment of an aspiring arbiter.

I think that a location map for all the arbiters would be helpful here, [(colour coded for the different levels!) I believe that Geoff Gammon intends preparing one], if only to point out where there is greatest need for the ECF to call for volunteers to train as arbiters.

NickFaulks
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by NickFaulks » Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:43 pm

Alan Atkinson wrote:I think that a location map for all the arbiters would be helpful here.
Perhaps they could be tagged, like pigeons.

Nick Grey
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Nick Grey » Thu Feb 16, 2017 1:42 am

Or criminals.
Perhaps there wasn't a arbiters/organisers 'nexus' but some suggestions here of an arbiter 'nexus'.
Best wishes to all trying to progress. And those training others.
Not sure why ECF not using it's budget or making some provision rather than getting individuals to pay.

Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Thu Feb 16, 2017 10:28 am

"Not sure why ECF not using it's budget or making some provision rather than getting individuals to pay."

Maybe ECF does contribute, but as individuals have to pay for playing titles (GM, IM, FM, CM), it's reasonable to have to pay for arbiter titles, especially if there's a training course. The FA course lasted two days from memory and the trainer should be paid for that.

Michael Flatt
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Michael Flatt » Thu Feb 16, 2017 12:24 pm

Not sure why ECF not using it's budget or making some provision rather than getting individuals to pay.
I don't believe that cost has ever been a major issue in Arbiter training. Rather, it has been the scarcity of suitably qualified individuals to run the training courses and subsequently perform assessments and validate each Arbiter's experience and performance in tournaments.

The Chess Arbiters' Association has taken a leading role in training British Arbiters by organising courses and even covering some of the cost. The work has fallen disproportionately on a few willing individuals and without them there would be even fewer qualified Arbiters.

The ECF Arbiter regulations could be improved by following FIDE practice, where the Chief Arbiter at an event documents an Arbiter's performance without the need for an external assessor.

David Sedgwick
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by David Sedgwick » Thu Feb 16, 2017 1:07 pm

Michael Flatt wrote:The ECF Arbiter regulations could be improved by following FIDE practice, where the Chief Arbiter at an event documents an Arbiter's performance without the need for an external assessor.
However, there does need to be an external assessor, the "FIDE Observer" at FIDE Arbiters' Seminars. This of course adds to the cost.

Stewart Reuben
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Stewart Reuben » Thu Feb 16, 2017 2:28 pm

Kevn >Maybe ECF does contribute, but as individuals have to pay for playing titles (GM, IM, FM, CM), it's reasonable to have to pay for arbiter titles, <

I remember when FIDE started charging for all titles. I just got in beforehand. The issue of the BCF, as then, passing hr charge on came up. I proposed the BCF shuld pay for GMs, WGMs and IAs. I lost the vote, but still believe it would be right. In England admiistrators are seldom paid for their work. One well-known admiistrator thought his daily allowance was a fee. I don't know whether it as declared for income tax!

Michael Flatt
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Michael Flatt » Thu Feb 16, 2017 2:37 pm

David Sedgwick wrote:
Michael Flatt wrote:The ECF Arbiter regulations could be improved by following FIDE practice, where the Chief Arbiter at an event documents an Arbiter's performance without the need for an external assessor.
However, there does need to be an external assessor, the "FIDE Observer" at FIDE Arbiters' Seminars. This of course adds to the cost.
That's true for the Training Seminar, but that wasn't my point.

My suggestion relates to overcoming the difficulty in acquiring arbiter norms at tournaments where there aren't sufficient ECF Arbiter Assessors available to attend and fill in the new ECF arbiter assessment reports. Perhaps, it would have been clearer if I had used the word tournament instead of event.

Brian Towers
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Brian Towers » Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:15 pm

Michael Flatt wrote:The ECF Arbiter regulations could be improved by following FIDE practice, where the Chief Arbiter at an event documents an Arbiter's performance without the need for an external assessor.
The chief arbiter at a FIDE rated event with the authority to sign an application form has to be an FA or IA so following that example would extend the assessor group to all level 4 and level 3 arbiters. That's quite an extension and would require a lot of thought on the part of the ECF. I wouldn't hold your breath.
Ah, but I was so much older then. I'm younger than that now.

NickFaulks
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by NickFaulks » Sun Feb 19, 2017 8:15 pm

Can someone explain why arbiting an event which is FIDE rated is considered to require fundamentally superior skills compared to arbiting one which is not?

Ian Thompson
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by Ian Thompson » Sun Feb 19, 2017 9:29 pm

NickFaulks wrote:Can someone explain why arbiting an event which is FIDE rated is considered to require fundamentally superior skills compared to arbiting one which is not?
There's nothing in the new ECF Arbiter Regulations that says it is. You might assume from the numbers attached to the various levels of arbiter that a level 3 arbiter was superior to a level 2 arbiter. As the ECF sets the requirements for someone being an ECF level 2 arbiter and FIDE sets the requirements for someone being an ECF level 3 arbiter, there's no reason why the standard required for level 2 status couldn't be higher than the standard required for level 3 status (other than the ECF requirement that you can't apply for the FIDE title without first having obtained the possibly higher standard ECF title).

NickFaulks
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Re: Proposed British Chess Championship Qualifying Regulations

Post by NickFaulks » Sun Feb 19, 2017 9:44 pm

Ian Thompson wrote: and FIDE sets the requirements for someone being an ECF level 3 arbiter
The only FIDE requirement is that you pay 25 euros, so it's entirely in the gift of the ECF.

I repeat my question - why do you need to be level 3 for a tournament that is FIDE rated, but not for one that isn't? Is it, like Gold membership, just an effort to deter FIDE rated events?

edit : I may be out of my depth here. I'm just talking about Licenced Arbiters - why is it so difficult to become one? In other European federations it seems to be much easier.

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