DGT/FIDE Offer to Federations to purchase clocks at a highly reduced rate

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
NickFaulks
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Re: FIDE Offer to Federations to purchase clocks at a highy reduced rate

Post by NickFaulks » Sun Oct 22, 2017 2:54 pm

Alex McFarlane wrote:I was not at the Development Commission Meeting but I was told by those who were that applications for clocks had to go through the Development Commission (as is apparently the case with current offers to developing nations).
Thanks, I wasn't there either because of a clash, but their minutes were the first place I should have looked. The whole file is too big to attach here, but the relevant item is
DGT Offer wrote: 
DGT through theır CEO Mr Hans Pees have consıderably ımproved their offer to Developing  Federations who wısh to Purchase DGT equıpment. For the DGT2010 the offer prıce is down to  15 euros a clock wıth the more recently developed 3000 clock at 20 euros. Furthermore & thıs ıs  a stunnıng offer these prıces wıll be avaılable to all Federatıons ın FIDE. 
 
Another major development ıs the development of a plastıc ınteractıve electronıc board. Wıth  everythıng ıncluded ıt wıll retaıl to Federatıons for 145 euros. It wıll come on the market ın  November 2017. 
See attachment wıth letter from DGT wıth specıal Development Prıce Lıst.
The letter says
DGT Letter wrote: "Dear Allan, dear Nigel,

For consideration at the FIDE Congress in Antalya, I submit below proposals reflecting DGT’s continued efforts to support FIDE goals of global chess development through Federations and special projects.

1. The Development price for chess clocks will be significantly reduced to 15 euro for the DGT2010 and to 20 euro for the DGT3000. The clocks shall receive a print on the back indicating they are supplied for FIDE Chess Development.

2. Affordable electronic boards are available from November 2017 that will further enable the global chess community to arrange live tournament broadcasting. The new Smart Boards can be used together with existing wooden DGT boards and the free LiveChess software. For FIDE Development purposes, a complete tournament set including the board, electronic chess pieces, cables and DGT3000 chess clock, will be made available for around 145 euro per set.

3. Currently only Federations in levels 3, 4 and 5 of the FIDE Development list are eligible for the low Development prices. I propose to simplify this and make clocks and boards available for Development prices to all FIDE Federations so that FIDE can approve Development orders as it sees fit, for example to support active Federations or special projects.

4. Non-electronic boards and sets as well as basic chess clocks are added to the Development pricelist to benefit Chess in Schools and other projects.

All as per the attached pricelist.

It should be noted that products supplied at Development prices are not meant for trade or resale.


I look forward to your response.


Best regards,

Hans Pees | DGT "
So yes, Development will have to approve all orders, although I don't believe they have ever said no.

David Robertson
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Re: FIDE Offer to Federations to purchase clocks at a highy reduced rate

Post by David Robertson » Sun Oct 22, 2017 6:17 pm

DGT Letter wrote:It should be noted that products supplied at Development prices are not meant for trade or resale
Hhmm. Good intentions sometimes lead to unintended outcomes. If a product is offered into a market well below its normal trading price, a secondary (resale) market will almost certainly develop. For this reason, NGOs and aid agencies are usually very cautious about encouraging (for example) western drug companies to supply cheap, or 'free', medicines. The problem lies in ensuring the products/medicines reach those who need them. But invariably, they must pass through the hands of 'gate-keepers'. And that's where the secondary market rake-off begins. True of medicines; likely true of chess clocks too

NickFaulks
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Re: FIDE Offer to Federations to purchase clocks at a highy reduced rate

Post by NickFaulks » Sun Oct 22, 2017 6:34 pm

David Robertson wrote: If a product is offered into a market well below its normal trading price, a secondary (resale) market will almost certainly develop.
The big question is, what will the normal trading price be?

NickFaulks
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Re: FIDE Offer to Federations to purchase clocks at a highy reduced rate

Post by NickFaulks » Sun Oct 22, 2017 6:38 pm

Carl Hibbard wrote:The ECF site does suggest this is a DGT offer.
I feel I should point out once per page that the title of this thread is misleading and not conducive to informed discussion.

Nick Grey
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Re: FIDE Offer to Federations to purchase clocks at a highy reduced rate

Post by Nick Grey » Sun Oct 22, 2017 6:50 pm

If our club can get this offer we will take it. ECF to be commended even with the short notice. I have thought that the current prices are very high.
Unfortunately for Nick Faulks if he is playing against Kingston tomorrow we are on analogue clocks.

David Robertson
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Re: FIDE Offer to Federations to purchase clocks at a highy reduced rate

Post by David Robertson » Sun Oct 22, 2017 7:02 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
David Robertson wrote: If a product is offered into a market well below its normal trading price, a secondary (resale) market will almost certainly develop.
The big question is, what will the normal trading price be?
This isn't the 'big question' at all. The Big Question - the only question worth asking - is whether the discounted clocks will reach their intended targets; or whether they'll be intercepted, then traded, by corrupt middle-men (or indeed, traded by the intended recipients themselves)

NickFaulks
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Re: DGT/FIDE Offer to Federations to purchase clocks at a highly reduced rate

Post by NickFaulks » Sun Oct 22, 2017 7:05 pm

David Robertson wrote: the only question worth asking - is whether the discounted clocks will reach their intended targets
Who do you believe DGT's intended targets are?

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Carl Hibbard
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Re: DGT/FIDE Offer to Federations to purchase clocks at a highly reduced rate

Post by Carl Hibbard » Sun Oct 22, 2017 7:21 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
Carl Hibbard wrote:The ECF site does suggest this is a DGT offer.
I feel I should point out once per page that the title of this thread is misleading and not conducive to informed discussion.
I changed the topic slightly and corrected the spelling.
Cheers
Carl Hibbard

David Williams
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Re: FIDE Offer to Federations to purchase clocks at a highy reduced rate

Post by David Williams » Mon Oct 23, 2017 10:58 am

David Robertson wrote:If a product is offered into a market well below its normal trading price, a secondary (resale) market will almost certainly develop . . . . True of medicines; likely true of chess clocks too
I think the 'almost certainly' needs a citation. I don't think it's generally true, and it's certainly only true if the product would have a high second-hand value. Medicines and concert tickets may be 'good as new' second-hand. Are chess clocks?
If anyone was to think of, say, giving free chess sets to every school in the country the market consequences seem to have been considered containable.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: FIDE Offer to Federations to purchase clocks at a highy reduced rate

Post by Roger de Coverly » Mon Oct 23, 2017 11:20 am

David Williams wrote: If anyone was to think of, say, giving free chess sets to every school in the country the market consequences seem to have been considered containable.
Perhaps you were thinking of the ECF's fiasco a few years back, as documented in the archives of this site. That failed because the capacity to produce the sets didn't exist, although most of the talk seemed to concentrate around distribution. The option of using existing commercial channels didn't seem to be have considered.

There are a couple of differences. One is that the product is known to exist and can presumably be manufactured in the required quantities. The second is that the number of chess clubs, leagues, Congresses and other organisations is somewhat lower in headcount that the number of schools. Presumably then the ECF Office isn't going to be swamped by the logistics of distribution.

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Marcus Misson
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Re: DGT/FIDE Offer to Federations to purchase clocks at a highly reduced rate

Post by Marcus Misson » Sun Jan 21, 2018 6:35 pm

Well done ECF - particularly Gary Willson.
I received the clocks my club had ordered last week.
Ever since we announced our interest in the offer, Gary kept us informed as to progress and seems to have had everything well organised.
I suspect that if things had gone a bit 'free sets for schools', we would never have heard the end of it on this forum.
Of course when things run smoothly we hear nothing.
Thanks Gary!
chessplayers are crazy when it comes to chess
but that's not to say they're not really good blokes

Roger Lancaster
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Re: DGT/FIDE Offer to Federations to purchase clocks at a highly reduced rate

Post by Roger Lancaster » Sun Jan 21, 2018 9:57 pm

Agree with Marcus - credit where it's due!

John Reyes
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Re: DGT/FIDE Offer to Federations to purchase clocks at a highly reduced rate

Post by John Reyes » Mon Jan 22, 2018 4:58 pm

thanks for the clocks

came and now we hope to be using this in our club soon
Any postings on here represent my personal views only

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