Director of Women's Chess

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
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Roger de Coverly
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Director of Women's Chess

Post by Roger de Coverly » Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:23 pm

It will be recalled that it took a certain amount of persistence to get the post created, starting with at least one failed motion to ECF Council meetings.

It appears the ECF Directors have gone off the idea, preferring instead the notion of a more general post to handle "development".

From the minutes
http://www.englishchess.org.uk/wp-conte ... y-2018.pdf
9.
Report on the Role of Director of Women’s Chess (JC & TW)
Following discussion, the Board believes that having the role of a Director of Women’s Chess did not necessarily address the right problems. The Board believes that massive attrition in the transition from primary to secondary and the lack of a welcoming environment for girls are the main causes for the imbalance in men and women actively playing chess. Because these might better be tackled at junior level, the Board resolved to remove the Director of Women’s Chess role from the ECF website and to prepare a paper on what a new Development Director role, focussing on these and other problems in English chess, might look like.
MP took a dissenting view, that there was a role for a Director of Women’s Chess,
for example advising on how tournaments and clubs could be made more welcoming
for women and trying to develop links with women's organisations or dealt with
women's issues. MP agreed with MT that the problem had been a lack of suitable
candidates coming forward.
The proposal was carried with one abstention, one against.

NickFaulks
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by NickFaulks » Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:15 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:23 pm
It appears the ECF Directors have gone off the idea, preferring instead the notion of a more general post to handle "development".
You can't help feeling that if the ideal candidate suddenly walked in and volunteered for the position, it would be revived.

Andrew Zigmond
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Andrew Zigmond » Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:04 pm

The ECF did have a Manager Of Women's Chess prior to the position being upgraded to a board level position. I believe Sarah Longson is quoted in a previous set of board minutes as saying that her role would have to be largely strategic as she had no operating budget.

I agree entirely with what Malcolm Pein is quoted as saying regarding the role of a Director of Women's Chess and certainly more needs to be done to encourage women to the game BUT I don't understand he considers this to be necessary at board level when the equally important role of Manager of Disabled Chess currently sits outside of the board. On that subject I feel there is a strong case for a Manager of Youth (18-30) chess.
Controller - Yorkshire League
Chairman - Harrogate Chess Club
All views expressed entirely my own

Jonathan Rogers
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Jonathan Rogers » Tue Feb 27, 2018 8:48 am

Yes, well. There is probably only one demographic in English chess - middle aged to elderly white middle class men - which is not in need of special measures :shock: :oops:

Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Tue Feb 27, 2018 10:30 am

"Yes, well. There is probably only one demographic in English chess - middle aged to elderly white middle class men - which is not in need of special measures "

At least we have the "satisfaction" of paying for everybody else!

Angus French
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Angus French » Tue Feb 27, 2018 11:57 am

Andrew Zigmond wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:04 pm
I believe Sarah Longson is quoted in a previous set of board minutes as saying that her role would have to be largely strategic as she had no operating budget.
There is a budget for Women's chess - it's £5K. See the 2017/18 detailed forecast and budget.

Jonathan Bryant
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Jonathan Bryant » Tue Feb 27, 2018 12:54 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:15 pm
Roger de Coverly wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:23 pm
It appears the ECF Directors have gone off the idea, preferring instead the notion of a more general post to handle "development".
You can't help feeling that if the ideal candidate suddenly walked in and volunteered for the position, it would be revived.

Perhaps. Although I do wonder why it is that the position has been so difficult to fill and why the ECF would be waiting for "an ideal candidate" to suddenly make themselves know.

I suppose we should be grateful that nobody has yet said,

"The view has been expressed that most of the position of Director of Women’s chess is vacant. We did not notice this. I think that demonstrates we are not biased."

(http://streathambrixtonchess.blogspot.c ... euben.html)


For what it’s worth, the appointment of Mike Truran notwithstanding, I don’t think the ECF has been great on diversity for decades
(http://streathambrixtonchess.blogspot.c ... .html#more)

The long-term toleration of nonsense like "If more females played chess so would more males" (viewtopic.php?f=25&t=6967&start=135#p172295)

and

"I try to get the attractive females interviewed."

(http://streathambrixtonchess.blogspot.c ... -nine.html)


rather believing in and promoting a message that runs something along the lines of

We aim to encourage more women to play chess for no other reason than we would like to encourage participation amongst groups that are currently under-represented in chess. We reject any statement or implication that the ECF welcomes women for the benefits that they bring male players.


takes it’s toll in the end.

FWIW (!) I don’t think there are easy solutions here.
FWIW(2) English chess is far from alone in having a diversity problem.

Neither of these justifies failing to acknowledge and move on from problematic behaviours and attitudes from the past, though.

Stewart Reuben
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Stewart Reuben » Wed Mar 07, 2018 5:04 pm

Jonathan Bryant >The long-term toleration of nonsense like "If more females played chess so would more males"<

Why is that nonense? I have a male friend who was involved in chess competitively and administratively for many, many years. He gave it up in favour of bridge because far more women play that game.
I realise that is arguing from a specific case, to the general, but it is hard to believe that it doesn't hold true.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Roger de Coverly » Wed Mar 07, 2018 6:04 pm

Stewart Reuben wrote:
Wed Mar 07, 2018 5:04 pm

Why is that nonsense?
It makes complete sense, but it's one of those thoughts you aren't supposed to have in the opinion of some who post here.

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IM Jack Rudd
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by IM Jack Rudd » Wed Mar 07, 2018 6:31 pm

I'm not sure I'd go as far as calling the opinion in question nonsense, but I would categorize it as unhelpful and counterproductive. If you want to get more women playing, you need to concentrate on ways to market the game to women, and on making women feel valued in their own right.

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JustinHorton
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by JustinHorton » Wed Mar 07, 2018 7:44 pm

Give me strength
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

lostontime.blogspot.com

John McKenna
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by John McKenna » Thu Mar 08, 2018 5:17 pm

And she said, The Philistines be upon thee... And he woke out of his sleep...
To find a for(u)m that accommodates the mess, that is the task of the artist now. (Samuel Beckett)

E Michael White
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by E Michael White » Sat Mar 10, 2018 9:42 pm

Jonathan Bryant wrote:
Tue Feb 27, 2018 12:54 pm
FWIW (!) I don’t think there are easy solutions here.
FWIW(2) English chess is far from alone in having a diversity problem.
Could try asking known returners like Gillian Moore and Deborah Pass why they returned and also those who never gave up why they didn't. Might be better information than old men guessing.

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Carl Hibbard
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Carl Hibbard » Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:13 pm

A post was removed from this one.
Cheers
Carl Hibbard

NickFaulks
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by NickFaulks » Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:19 pm

Carl Hibbard wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:13 pm
A post was removed from this one.
That's a shame.

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