Director of Women's Chess

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
Angus French
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Angus French » Wed Jun 20, 2018 9:05 pm

David Sedgwick wrote:
Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:20 pm
Roger de Coverly wrote:
Wed Jun 20, 2018 7:26 pm
Was there a suggestion that the ECF Board had two potential candidates in mind for the vacancy?
Yes there was. If the other candidate was who I think it was, then I am very pleased that Chris Fegan has been preferred.
Was the other candidate Sue Dunham? (Of course, another option would have been to appoint neither.)

Andrew Zigmond
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Andrew Zigmond » Wed Jun 20, 2018 9:42 pm

I have to admit that I have some misgivings about this appointment. Having said that the appointment must have been made at board level and if you look at the statistics five members of the Ehr board (discounting the President remain). Of these five two have been attacked personally by Chris Fegan and a further two have drawn his ire by virtue of being arbiters. Another senior member of the board, while not on the board at the time, was very closely involved in the controversy. There is no way Chris Fegan could have been appointed without at least some of their votes so if they are prepared to give him a chance, then somebody as unimportant as me should do the same.
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Roger de Coverly
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Roger de Coverly » Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:33 pm

Angus French wrote:
Wed Jun 20, 2018 9:05 pm
Was the other candidate Sue Dunham?
The short lived official forum declined to allow its discussions to be archived by Google. A search for "Sue Dunham Chess" only comes up with the mentions here and on the Streatham blog.

From memory wasn't "she" keen on advocacy of support for women's chess?

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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Andrew Zigmond » Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:45 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:33 pm
Angus French wrote:
Wed Jun 20, 2018 9:05 pm
Was the other candidate Sue Dunham?
The short lived official forum declined to allow its discussions to be archived by Google. A search for "Sue Dunham Chess" only comes up with the mentions here and on the Streatham blog.

From memory wasn't "she" keen on advocacy of support for women's chess?
Without wanting to dig up the past an early blunder by the official forum was trumpeting a `real names` policy and implying that the unofficial forum allowed pseudonyms. When Carl challenged this they declined to provide examples and the ill feeling never went away. Matters were of course then compounded by the official forum having allowed a fairly obvious false name (Sue Dunham) to pass under the radar. To be fair the then Commercial Director apologised for the gaffe and noted that `Sue Dunham` had agreed to `go and waste time elsewhere`.

The implication that somebody who believed so passionately in the official forum would have a connection to a false profile seems hard to believe. I'm sure the new Director of Women's Chess will have much to say about what he considers, `an ill informed talking shop of the self appointed` going forward but Carl should rule these posts out of order.
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Roger de Coverly
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Roger de Coverly » Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:40 am

As a reasonable premise, there should be a majority of directors on the ECF board who aren't beholden to Malcolm in any shape or form? That means no involvement with CSC or any tournaments under CSC auspices.

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JustinHorton
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by JustinHorton » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:32 am

Andrew Zigmond wrote:
Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:45 pm
The implication that somebody who believed so passionately in the official forum would have a connection to a false profile seems hard to believe.
Not so much "hard to believe" as "alternative explanations are hard to come up with".
David Sedgwick wrote:
Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:20 pm
I for one welcome this attempt to put the problems of 2015 where they belong - in the past.
Frankly the best way to leave those problems in the past would be if we never heard the name Chris Fegan again, but tell me - who was the other candidate? They'd have to go some to be a worse prospect than Fegan.
Roger de Coverly wrote:
Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:40 am
As a reasonable premise, there should be a majority of directors on the ECF board who aren't beholden to Malcolm in any shape or form?
Statement of the obvious if you ask me.
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Brendan O'Gorman
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Brendan O'Gorman » Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:08 am

Meanwhile, in another part of the forest … https://www.gofundme.com/womenschessnetwork

NickFaulks
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by NickFaulks » Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:15 am

Brendan O'Gorman wrote:
Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:08 am
Meanwhile, in another part of the forest … url]https://www.gofundme.com/womenschessnetwork[/url]
Have any of the England Women's team actually complained about their captain being a man? My guess is that there are only a few qualified female candidates, and those that are available are all playing.

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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Andrew Zigmond » Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:24 am

Brendan O'Gorman wrote:
Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:08 am
Meanwhile, in another part of the forest … https://www.gofundme.com/womenschessnetwork
Interesting reading. As I said in the thread regarding the Casual Chess cafe proposal it seems that the organiser has absolutely no understanding of how the ECF works.

Given that the next ECF AGM is only four months away (and a lot of chess activity goes dormant over the Summer anyway) I'm increasingly surprised that the ECF has made what was always going to be a slightly controversial appointment when an open election could have been held in October.
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Stewart Reuben
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Re: Dirennctor of Women's Chess

Post by Stewart Reuben » Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:33 am

This requirement that, a female captain of the English women's team, be female, shows a misunderstanding of the objectives.
The main function of such a captain is to help in preparation. One would want all strong female English players to play. I doubt many strong, English-speaking, foreign women are available.
BUT we have an English women's team competing (for the first time) in the World 50+ Team championship in Radebeul. It hadn't occurred to me, prior to this message, to seek a non-playing captain of that team and nobody suggested it to me. The event starts 7 July.
It's very late. But should I contact Jovanka, satisfying everybody?

Hok Yin Stephen Chiu
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Hok Yin Stephen Chiu » Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:59 am

I must admit I was not expecting to see this particular headline at this point, I think if I was to use terms of my generation, my initial thought was "that was quite woke of the ECF!" [If you urban dictionary it, you may find some appropriate definitions].

Anyhow, there are a few things to say here: firstly assuming the candidates (man or woman) are say all professionals, with some chess experience, motivated, etc, etc, then they are all 'valid' candidates. I am not here to argue that only women should be able to run for that particular role, however, on one hand we are not going to invalidate anyone for running, on the other, it is probably a fair assumption to expect the female candidates to be more likely to have the relevant experiences on the issue of Women's Chess. The latter is strictly a matter of likelihood not a given, hence, I was not exactly expecting this news...

I wonder if anyone is aware of whether the identities of the other two candidates is public information, and more pertinently the nature of their manifestos/applications? I suspect that would make for good reading.

The new director rightly notes out the 'imbalances' in gender, but I wonder whether his manifesto/application is public, as I would be interested in seeing his proposals to widen participation on this front in a meaningful way across the country?
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NickFaulks
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by NickFaulks » Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:02 pm

Andrew Zigmond wrote:
Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:24 am
I'm increasingly surprised that the ECF has made what was always going to be a slightly controversial appointment when an open election could have been held in October.
It does make you wonder whether this Board appointment was entirely about women's chess.

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David Shepherd
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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by David Shepherd » Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:06 pm

Stewart Reuben wrote:
Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:33 am
It hadn't occurred to me, prior to this message, to seek a non-playing captain of that team and nobody suggested it to me. The event starts 7 July.
It's very late. But should I contact Jovanka, satisfying everybody?
The answer must surely be based on the following:

1) Would the funding be available?
2) Would the team members want this to happen?

If the answer to both these questions is yes then of course its worth at least contacting her to see if she is available.

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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by David Robertson » Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:10 pm

If Chris Fegan were to self-identify as Sue Dunham (assuming Sue Dunham isn't really Glen Stark), doesn't that tick every box and solve all problems? Just asking :)

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Re: Director of Women's Chess

Post by Andrew Zigmond » Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:27 pm

The previous Director of Women's Chess is quoted in a set of board minutes as noting that her role was largely strategic and presumably that hasn't changed. What worries me is what the new director may try to influence with regard to the wider ECF strategy, particularly in view of his disdain for council and the volunteer base.

The pitch on GoFundMe is the reaction of a group of individuals who have failed to get their way with the ECF. It is an embarrassing mess of poor knowledge and point missing from start to finish but at least they are aiming for something positive out of it and the piece probably won't be widely read outside of chess circles. However it does put me in mind of another group of individuals whose agenda was rejected by the ECF and led to an equally ill informed article that was published in the Guardian. The irony!
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