SCCA Challenge Cup

Historical knowledge and information regarding our great game.
Paul Dupré
Posts: 331
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 11:04 pm
Location: Sutton, Surrey

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Paul Dupré » Fri Oct 06, 2023 7:23 pm

Jon D'Souza-Eva wrote:
Fri Oct 06, 2023 11:16 am
The originator of Surrey Chess News was someone called Leslie Fletcher (see http://streathambrixtonchess.blogspot.c ... ame-5.html) and he had a (half) brother called Archibald Frederick James Fletcher. I suppose Archibald could have been the "A Fletcher" who was Surrey Champion in 1927. He'd have been 22 years old at the time. However I have no evidence that Archibald even played chess, let alone that he was strong enough to become Surrey Champion.
See https://www.familysearch.org/tree/perso ... s/GXPT-HF6 for family of Leslie Elliott Fletcher (born Leslie Elliott Britton).
He could be this chap who played Alekhine in 1928
https://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1012556
Any postings on here represent the truth, and nothing but the truth, so help me God,
...and by the way the world is flat.

Paul Dupré
Posts: 331
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 11:04 pm
Location: Sutton, Surrey

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Paul Dupré » Fri Oct 06, 2023 7:28 pm

The kibitzers call him Alan Fletcher, don't know why.

Maybe where it says...
See <British Chess a Magazine 1928>, pg. 290.
Any postings on here represent the truth, and nothing but the truth, so help me God,
...and by the way the world is flat.

Paul Dupré
Posts: 331
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 11:04 pm
Location: Sutton, Surrey

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Paul Dupré » Fri Oct 06, 2023 8:07 pm

ChessBase says black is Andy Fletcher b.1952
Any postings on here represent the truth, and nothing but the truth, so help me God,
...and by the way the world is flat.

Paul Dupré
Posts: 331
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 11:04 pm
Location: Sutton, Surrey

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Paul Dupré » Fri Oct 06, 2023 8:37 pm

Same game again on YouTube, but with the name Alan Linnell Fletcher
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=csf8aFv-wjE

I think we have a winner, in the comments section it says
@ChessskillBlogspot 10 years ago
According to _Alekhine in Europe and Asia_ (1993) by John Donaldson, Nikolay Minev, and Yasser Seirawan, the game against Fletcher was part of a simul of six games. Two of the games, but not this one, were blindfold games. Fletcher was champion of Surrey and one of London's top players at the time. Alekhine beat three of London's top players, while losing to Victor Burger. In the two blindfold games, Alekhine had a win and a draw.
Last edited by Paul Dupré on Fri Oct 06, 2023 8:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Any postings on here represent the truth, and nothing but the truth, so help me God,
...and by the way the world is flat.

Jon D'Souza-Eva
Posts: 161
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2023 7:53 am

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Jon D'Souza-Eva » Fri Oct 06, 2023 8:49 pm

The A Fletcher who played Alekhine in 1928 definitely wasn't the New Zealand player Alan Linnell Fletcher (13 September 1908 – 15 March 1999). His grandson kibitzed on chessgames.com to confirm this:
https://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessplayer?pid=13111

Paul Dupré
Posts: 331
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 11:04 pm
Location: Sutton, Surrey

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Paul Dupré » Fri Oct 06, 2023 8:56 pm

Paul Dupré wrote:
Fri Oct 06, 2023 8:37 pm
Same game again on YouTube, but with the name Alan Linnell Fletcher
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=csf8aFv-wjE

I think we have a winner, in the comments section it says
@ChessskillBlogspot 10 years ago
According to _Alekhine in Europe and Asia_ (1993) by John Donaldson, Nikolay Minev, and Yasser Seirawan, the game against Fletcher was part of a simul of six games. Two of the games, but not this one, were blindfold games. Fletcher was champion of Surrey and one of London's top players at the time. Alekhine beat three of London's top players, while losing to Victor Burger. In the two blindfold games, Alekhine had a win and a draw.
Ah, not him then.
Any postings on here represent the truth, and nothing but the truth, so help me God,
...and by the way the world is flat.

Jon D'Souza-Eva
Posts: 161
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2023 7:53 am

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Jon D'Souza-Eva » Fri Oct 06, 2023 8:59 pm

Page 290 of The British Chess Magazine (1928, volume 48) seems to give Black's name as "A Fletcher":
https://tinypic.host/image/9qy74

However a copy of The British Chess Magazine from 1927 (volumes 47-48) gives his club and a much needed middle initial:
"Lud-Eagle Chess Club - .... The club champion, A. E. Fletcher, also won the championship of Surrey".

This should make the task of tracking him down much easier!

Richard James
Posts: 1179
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2007 7:34 pm
Location: Twickenham

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Richard James » Fri Oct 06, 2023 11:06 pm

I'm not entirely convinced by the middle initial as he's always just A Fletcher in the press. The BCM at that period isn't the most reliable of sources.

Here's a game, featuring some rather interminable manoeuvring, from the 1932 Surrey Championship. (I've just returned from spending the evening in a church opposite the church where his opponent was married.)



RJ Blackburn is even more elusive than A Fletcher. I'll get back to you on him later.

Jon D'Souza-Eva
Posts: 161
Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2023 7:53 am

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Jon D'Souza-Eva » Mon Oct 09, 2023 12:26 am

In the January 1963 issue of the SCCU Bulletin (available from https://sccu-chess.com/index.php/en/bulletin) there's the result of an 80 board match between Surrey and Essex. On board 76 for Surrey is a T. H. Robertson, who could be the same T. H. Robertson who won the SCCA Challenge Cup in 1925.

User avatar
Gerard Killoran
Posts: 1009
Joined: Sun Oct 04, 2009 11:51 am

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Gerard Killoran » Mon Oct 09, 2023 12:32 pm

T. H. Robertson top bard for Thornton Heath and Norbury

Norwood News - Friday 18 December 1925 p14.png

Revenge! However the teams are the wrong way round it seems...

Streatham News - Friday 19 October 1928 p.12.png
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

User avatar
Gerard Killoran
Posts: 1009
Joined: Sun Oct 04, 2009 11:51 am

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Gerard Killoran » Mon Oct 09, 2023 12:47 pm

And still playing for Battersea in 1961!

Norwood News _ Friday 20 October 1961 p15.png
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

User avatar
Gerard Killoran
Posts: 1009
Joined: Sun Oct 04, 2009 11:51 am

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Gerard Killoran » Mon Oct 09, 2023 3:35 pm




User avatar
Gerard Killoran
Posts: 1009
Joined: Sun Oct 04, 2009 11:51 am

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Gerard Killoran » Mon Oct 09, 2023 3:51 pm


Paul Dupré
Posts: 331
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 11:04 pm
Location: Sutton, Surrey

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Paul Dupré » Wed Oct 11, 2023 7:32 am

Gerard Killoran wrote:
Mon Oct 09, 2023 12:32 pm
Revenge! However the teams are the wrong way round it seems...
Streatham News - Friday 19 October 1928 p.12.png
No revenge, Thames Valley won the Alexander Cup in 1925 and 1928. Also in 1924...

The headline is wrong !!!

Both results are correct. Over 10 boards in 1928 and 1925 over 12 boards, it seems.

Thanks for the post Gerard
Any postings on here represent the truth, and nothing but the truth, so help me God,
...and by the way the world is flat.

Paul Dupré
Posts: 331
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 11:04 pm
Location: Sutton, Surrey

Re: SCCA Challenge Cup

Post by Paul Dupré » Wed Oct 11, 2023 7:42 am

That's strange though, T H Robertson is listed as Surrey Champion in 1925 playing for Battersea.
Clearly, it should be Thornton Heath & Norbury.

Battersea are claiming 14 winners of the SCCA Challenge Cup on their website, but maybe the SCCA historical records are not 100% accurate.
Any postings on here represent the truth, and nothing but the truth, so help me God,
...and by the way the world is flat.