Graves of famous chess players

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Graves of famous chess players

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Thu Aug 19, 2010 2:38 am

Following on from something in another thread, I managed to come up with a list of locations for graves of famous chess players. I was hoping it would be of interest to others here, and maybe people can provide more details as well.

The sources I used were the following:

Graves webpage from Edward Winter's chess history site
Search results from Find a Grave.com
Search results from Chess Notes archive

I haven't looked through all the links from the Chess Notes search yet.

Paul Morphy: Grave in St Louis Cemetery No. 1, New Orleans, USA.

Adolf Anderssen: Grave in Osobowicki Cemetery, Wrocław, Poland.

Johannes Zukertort: Cremated. Memorial slab in Brompton Cemetery, London, UK.

Louis-Charles Mahé de La Bourdonnais: Grave in Kensal Green Cemetery, London, UK.

Alexander McDonnell: Grave in Kensal Green Cemetery, London, UK.

Pierre Charles Fournier de Saint-Amant: UNKNOWN (died in Hydra, Algeria)

Howard Staunton: Grave and memorial in Kensal Green Cemetery, London, UK.

Wilhelm Steinitz: The Evergreens Cemetery, Brooklyn, Kings County, New York, USA.

Emanuel Lasker: Grave in Shearith Israel/Beth Olom Cemetery, Cypress Hills, Queens, New York/Long Island, USA.

José Raúl Capablanca: Grave and monument in Colón Cemetery, Havana, Cuba.

Alexander Alekhine: Grave and monument at Montparnasse Cemetery, Paris, France

Max Euwe: Cremated. Memorial bust on the Max Euweplein in Amsterdam, the Netherlands.

Mikhail Botvinnik: Novodevichy Cemetery, Moscow, Russia.

Vasily Smyslov: Novodevichy Cemetery, Moscow, Moscow Federal City, Russian Federation.

Mikhail Tal: Shmerly Cemetery, Riga, Riga City, Latvia.

Tigran Petrosian: Vagankovo Cemetery, Moscow, Russia.

Bobby Fischer: Laugardaelir Church Cemetery, Selfoss, Hafnarfjordur, Iceland.

Maybe add: Marshall, Spielmann, Nimzowitsch, Tarrasch, Pillsbury, Charousek, Najdorf, Noteboom, Winawer, Grünfeld, Zinkl, Treybal, Saavedra, Bohatirchuk, Esteban Canal, Bronstein, Flamberg, Ottó Bláthy (all mentioned on Edward Winter's web page or at 'Find a Grave.com' - extended list started below).

Najdorf: Cementerio de la Tablada, Buenos Aires, Argentina.
Spielmann: Norra begravningsplatsen (Northern Cemetery), Stockholm, Stockholms Lan, Sweden.
Nimzowitsch: Bispebjerg Cemetery, Copenhagen, Hovedstaden Region, Denmark.
Ottó Bláthy: Kerepesi Cemetery, Budapest, Budapest Capital District, Hungary.

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Re: Graves of famous chess players

Post by George Szaszvari » Sat Nov 06, 2010 5:46 am

["Christopher Kreuzer"]Following on from something in another thread, I managed to come up with a list of locations for graves of famous chess players. I was hoping it would be of interest to others here, and maybe people can provide more details as well.


I don't know whether François-André Danican Philidor is mentioned in any of these given
sources, but in the early 90s (when living in London) it occurred to me that his bicentennial
was coming up in 1995 and that some kind of memorial event (perhaps a tournament inviting
some French players and even chess playing musicians to participate) would not be amiss.
I checked the Westminster archives where the microfiche death/burial certificate (I don't
recall which) spells his name "Phillidor", the archivist on duty explaining that such misspellings
were common.

From the archives I went to St James, Piccadilly, where Philidor is buried, and spoke to the
Dean (or Warden?) about involving St James in possible future bicentennial memorial activities,
but as it turned out I regretfully did not get others involved, with a possible sponsor, and nothing
came of these ideas.

Good luck in finding out where the exact grave location might be since the graveyard
had been churned up and most of it lost to posterity by bombing during World War II.

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Re: Graves of famous chess players

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Sat Nov 06, 2010 9:06 pm

George Szaszvari wrote:From the archives I went to St James, Piccadilly, where Philidor is buried [...] Good luck in finding out where the exact grave location might be since the graveyard had been churned up and most of it lost to posterity by bombing during World War II.
Thanks for mentioning Philidor. I hadn't realised he was buried in London. I'm sure others will have looked before and failed, but I may drop by St James's Church, Piccadilly, and see if the graveyard is completely gone, or roughly where it was. Failing that, would there be any plaques or memorials anywhere in London? I see there is a bust of Philidor on the Opera Garnier in Paris, but I can't see any records of anything else. I see he was buried in London because he was stranded here when the French Revolution occurred, He died in 1795 at the age of 68. Does anyone know how long he was in London for (i.e. when he arrived?) and maybe where he lived while here?

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Re: Graves of famous chess players

Post by John Saunders » Sun Nov 07, 2010 9:52 am

Oddly enough, a few weeks ago I came upon something interesting about Philidor's grave (or rather lack of it) on the internet. I found the following website (in Spanish). Although I claim no detailed knowledge of the subject myself, the research work (by Frank Mayer and Joan Canal in 2007) looks to have been well done.

http://www.tabladeflandes.com/frank_may ... yer72.html

To summarise what it says on the website: by the time of Philidor's death, the dead of the parish of St James, Piccadilly, were being buried at a graveyard at what is today St James' Gardens, Camden (Hampstead Road, NW1, near Euston Station), and not at St James' Piccadilly as had been generally supposed. Though the researcher was unable to locate the actual grave of Philidor, he came upon a crumbling memorial (there is a photo at the website) which he suggests has Philidor's coat of arms. Apparently the (now defunct) Philidor Society of Paris was aware of the memorial's existence but I am not sure of the extent to which British historians (chess or general), or the local authority in Camden, are aware of this. If it can be corroborated that the memorial is indeed directly connected to Philidor, it is a significant discovery. It is a great shame that the memorial is so neglected: it deserves to be repaired and made the subject of some sort of commemorative project.
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Re: Graves of famous chess players

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Sun Nov 07, 2010 11:42 am

John Saunders wrote:Oddly enough, a few weeks ago I came upon something interesting about Philidor's grave (or rather lack of it) on the internet. I found the following website (in Spanish). Although I claim no detailed knowledge of the subject myself, the research work (by Frank Mayer and Joan Canal in 2007) looks to have been well done.

http://www.tabladeflandes.com/frank_may ... yer72.html

To summarise what it says on the website: by the time of Philidor's death, the dead of the parish of St James, Piccadilly, were being buried at a graveyard at what is today St James' Gardens, Camden (Hampstead Road, NW1, near Euston Station), and not at St James' Piccadilly as had been generally supposed. Though the researcher was unable to locate the actual grave of Philidor, he came upon a crumbling memorial (there is a photo at the website) which he suggests has Philidor's coat of arms. Apparently the (now defunct) Philidor Society of Paris was aware of the memorial's existence but I am not sure of the extent to which British historians (chess or general), or the local authority in Camden, are aware of this. If it can be corroborated that the memorial is indeed directly connected to Philidor, it is a significant discovery. It is a great shame that the memorial is so neglected: it deserves to be repaired and made the subject of some sort of commemorative project.
Goodness, that's amazing. I suppose the points to start with would be Mayer and Canal (to see if they have any further information), and maybe someone in Paris can find records of this defunct Philidor Society of Paris. There must surely have been some records in London as well, but those might be difficult to find - I wonder which archives or institution might have these records from the last decade of the 18th century, if they still exist? The other starting point would be that burial/death certificate that George found in the Westminster Archives (spelt 'Phillidor'). I wonder how much more research is needed before any commemoration project would become viable?

On the subject of other representations of Philidor, the photo at the bottom of the website John linked to shows what looks like another bust of Philidor, with the caption saying it is courtesy of the German publishers Exzelsior-Verlag. It looks different to the one on the Opera Garnier, so I wonder where that bust is or was, and when it was carved and by whom.

One other thing I noticed was that the article of September 2, 1795 in The Times says that Philidor was "near eighty years of age", but either that should have been seventy, or something is wrong with the birth year (Mayer and Canal note this discrepancy in their article). It also says he was a "member of the chess club near 30 years", but I haven't been able to find out exactly when Philidor visited London and where he stayed. I wonder if the Poldauf book that Mayer and Canal started with has anything on that?

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Re: Graves of famous chess players

Post by Tim Harding » Sun Nov 07, 2010 2:47 pm

It was John Keeble of Norwich who first discovered the burial record of Philidor in the 1920s (see the article published in The Times for the bicentenary of his birth).
The burial record of St James Piccadilly is in the Westminster archive. It is just a very brief one-line entry with no additional information beyond name and date of burial. It does not say the date of death, which is usually given incorrectly as 31 August 1795.
There was no state certification of deaths until decades later.
The spelling Phillidor was quite commonly seen in newspaper reports also.
In 2009 the Chess Cafe published two articles I have written on Philidor's time in England which can be seen in
their archive:
http://www.chesscafe.com/text/kibitz156.pdf
and
http://www.chesscafe.com/text/kibitz157.pdf

These answer some of the questions raised by previous posters in this thread.
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Re: Graves of famous chess players

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Sun Nov 07, 2010 3:15 pm

Tim Harding wrote:In 2009 the Chess Cafe published two articles I have written on Philidor's time in England which can be seen in their archive:
http://www.chesscafe.com/text/kibitz156.pdf
and
http://www.chesscafe.com/text/kibitz157.pdf

These answer some of the questions raised by previous posters in this thread.
Thanks for the links to those articles. I've just read them (well, actually only halfway through the second one) and he was in London a lot, which does answer my previous question. It reminds me a lot of what I've read of poets and scientists at that time, who travelled between London and Paris a lot. The journey wouldn't have been as quick as it is today, but I get the impression that it was a fairly routine journey for those with the standing in society and the money to travel often between the two countries.

I loved the bit about the racehorse! :)

One question I did have is where the pictures are from. I have a specific interest in pictures and artworks and their provenance, and I would be interested to know whether those ones are from the newspapers you were looking at, or from elsewhere?

About Philidor's playing strength, I always thought that the primary evidence for this was from the books he wrote. How strong a chess player would he have had to have been to (without a computer!) analyse endgames and other positions the way he did?

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Re: Graves of famous chess players

Post by George Szaszvari » Tue Nov 09, 2010 8:53 pm

Christopher Kreuzer wrote: but I may drop by St James's Church, Piccadilly, and see if the graveyard is completely gone, or roughly where it was.
Please let us know if you find anything. The information supplied by John and Tim suggests that the identified
coat of arms in the Camden graveyard would be the next step in this detective story. Good luck!

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Re: Graves of famous chess players

Post by Stewart Reuben » Wed Nov 17, 2010 11:18 pm

I did see Paul Morphy's resting place in 1965. In common with most New Orleans burials it was above ground, due to the swampy nature of the ground. It was one of the most famous in the town.
I have neither seen, nor heard, of whether it is still there after the terrible hurricane.
At the same time I also visited the Paul Morphy Club but it no longer had anything to do with chess. It was a private club and I was not made welcome. Well, I doubt very much I would have been 100 years earlier!
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Re: Graves of famous chess players

Post by Jon D'Souza-Eva » Thu Nov 18, 2010 9:17 am

Stewart Reuben wrote:I did see Paul Morphy's resting place in 1965. In common with most New Orleans burials it was above ground, due to the swampy nature of the ground. It was one of the most famous in the town.
I have neither seen, nor heard, of whether it is still there after the terrible hurricane.
This photo on the "Find a Grave" website was uploaded earlier this year, so hopefully Morphy's tomb survived the hurricane.
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cg ... i=26973321

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Re: Graves of famous chess players

Post by Simon Spivack » Wed Nov 24, 2010 5:06 pm

Like John, I have no detailed knowledge of Philidor. There is a brief mention in my copy of the Oxford Companion To Music (tenth edition); however, I doubt there is anything in there that is not already known to Tim.
John Saunders wrote:To summarise what it says on the website: by the time of Philidor's death, the dead of the parish of St James, Piccadilly, were being buried at a graveyard at what is today St James' Gardens, Camden (Hampstead Road, NW1, near Euston Station), and not at St James' Piccadilly as had been generally supposed. Though the researcher was unable to locate the actual grave of Philidor, he came upon a crumbling memorial (there is a photo at the website) which he suggests has Philidor's coat of arms.
I visited the Gardens last Saturday. Locating the memorial was easy. I couldn't find anything to read either, not that that means much. I am sceptical.
Tim Harding wrote:The burial record of St James Piccadilly is in the Westminster archive. It is just a very brief one-line entry with no additional information beyond name and date of burial.
There is a lot of material wrt the Camden site, it can be found here.

Is this different to what Tim found? Even if yes, it need not necessarily shed any more light.

Note in particular:

System ID SJC/0494/1/325
Finding No 494/325
Title Burial ledger (pay) volume 2
Date 1 Jan 1795-31 Dec 1799
Level file



Also, for the sake of completeness, there is the poor burial ledger:

System ID SJC/0494/1/338
Finding No 494/338
Title Poor burial ledger, volume 2
Date 1 Jan 1795-31 Dec 1799
Level file


There is an index to the burial ledger:

System ID SJC/0494/1/344
Finding No 494/344
Title Index to burial ledger, volume 1
Description Scope and Content
(494/324)
Date nd [1795]
Level file


Volume 2 appears to be missing, but, assuming it follows the pattern of the index to the poor ledger, that is for 1800.

There is an index to the poor burial ledger:

System ID SJC/0494/1/349
Finding No 494/349
Title Index to poor burial ledger, volume 1
Description Scope and Content
(494/337)
Date nd [1795]
Level file


There is a burial fee appropriation account:

System ID SJC/0494/1/354
Finding No 494/354
Title Burial fee appropriation account
Date 1 Jan 1795-31 Dec 1799
Level file



Finally:

System ID SJC/0494/1/373
Finding No 494/373
Title Plan of St. James' third burial ground with occupants of burial spaces identified and cross-referenced to volumes 1 and 2 of the burial ledgers (494/324-325)
Date nd [1800]
Level file



Although this says 1800, I presume up to 1800 is meant, otherwise, it is not immediately obvious why the volumes are cross-referenced. I do not understand what is meant by "third burial ground". Is it an allusion to the other St James' in Piccadilly, amongst other things? It is possible that this is the first file to check. The moving of the graves is a complication.




With my eyesight it is likely to be a wasted trip. However, it need not be so for others.

Anyone wishing to visit should read this:

specifically:
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Re: Graves of famous chess players

Post by Stewart Reuben » Wed Nov 24, 2010 5:33 pm

Although not directly relevant, some of you may not know and few, if any, came. There was a recital of some of Philidor's music at Simpson's at a chess event some years ago. Of course Ray Keene arranged it - no the event, not the music!
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Re: Graves of famous chess players

Post by George Szaszvari » Wed Nov 24, 2010 8:50 pm

Stewart Reuben wrote:Although not directly relevant, some of you may not know and few, if any, came. There was a recital of some of Philidor's music at Simpson's at a chess event some years ago. Of course Ray Keene arranged it - no the event, not the music!
Stewart Reuben
Well done, Ray Keene, one of the few influential chessplayers who has an interest in promoting artistic
connections to chess. Having been a frequent listener to the BBC Third Programme (is it still called that?)
when living in London, I was pleasantly surprised to hear a couple of pieces by Philidor on that radio station
over the years. In Phoenix we have KBAQ (affectionately called Kay-Bach) and they play a lot of unusual
stuff, so I await hearing another Philidor piece some time soon!

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Re: Graves of famous chess players

Post by Stewart Reuben » Thu Nov 25, 2010 1:53 am

You have to be careful. There were several composers in the Philidor family in the same era.
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Re: Graves of famous chess players

Post by George Szaszvari » Thu Nov 25, 2010 6:01 pm

Stewart Reuben wrote:You have to be careful. There were several composers in the Philidor family in the same era.
Stewart Reuben
Yes, large musical families typically need such care, the Bach family being
the most famous example. The Couperin family was another. The appellation
François-André Danican would be needed to identify the chessplayer, but even
if it were another member of the Philidor family, I'd still tend to listen just out
of curiosity.

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