English victories against reigning World Champions

[Matt Mackenzie]

Matt Mackenzie>Alekhine always made clear he would have a rematch with Capa if JRC matched the conditions he (AAA) had had to fulfil for their 1927 match. It is not really his fault that the world economic crash soon afterwards made that a rather more daunting prospect...<

Matt, please note that those conditions applied only to Capablanca - they were not applied to Bogoljubow and Euwe.

Of course not, they had not made such demands of Alekhine previously. Unlike his predecessor as WC.

[John McKenna]

Alekhine, Bogoljubow, Capablanca (then World Champion), Maroczy, Rubinstein, Reti, Tartakower & Vidmar all signed the "London Rules" in 1922.

Euwe was the youngest competitor at that tournament. I don't know if he signed at the time, or not.

(Lasker, Nimzowitch & Spielmann were not there and so did not sign.)

Alekhine played their 1927 World Ch. match, in Buenos Aires, under those agreed London Rules.

Capa did try to change them - particularly the number of games - soon after he'd lost the title and was seeking a rematch.

Alekhine was adamant about keeping them unchanged - particularly for Capablanca.

Why did he allow Bogoljubow, a London Rules signatory, two title matches under a relaxed version of them, but wouldn't hardly budge at all when it came to a rematch with Capablanca?

Even when Capa later (in Dec. 1929 the press carried reports of a rematch in 1930) made efforts to issue a challenge in accordamce with the "London Rules" Alekhine made no concessions to him, despite the NY stockmarket crash, but did so for the other two challengers.

In 1930 for San Remo Alekhine demanded a doubling of his 20,000 lira fee if Capa were to play, too. Of course Capa was not invited. And, the same kind of conditions are said to have been applied for Bled, 1931.

All that ducking & diving - Alekhine was determined never to allow a rematch and probably welcomed any and all obstacles to one.

[John McKenna]

To me, all of the above shows that between 1929 and 1946 Alekhine made a mockery of the process to produce a challenger for the World Championship and thereby brought both it and himself into disrepute.

Any list of those who defeated a World Chess Champion will be haunted by the sins of omission of the champions themselves.

Just getting to play against them can be problematical even for their peers.

So beware, all who enter here, it's not as simple as it seems, then again, it hardly ever is.

[David McAlister]

Anyone want to have a go at English victories against these World Champions - Khalifman (FIDE Las Vegas 1999), Ponomariov (FIDE Moscow 2001), Kasimdzhanov (FIDE Tripoli 2004) and Topalov (FIDE San Luis 2005)?

[MJMcCready]

Anyone want to have a go at English victories against these World Champions - Khalifman (FIDE Las Vegas 1999), Ponomariov (FIDE Moscow 2001), Kasimdzhanov (FIDE Tripoli 2004) and Topalov (FIDE San Luis 2005)?

A valid post, I would also like to know.

[Nick Burrows]

I was testing Chat GPT and asked it for the best game of Michael Basman. Here is it's response:

One of his most famous games is his victory against Anatoly Karpov at the 1974 Luton tournament.

[Event "Luton"] [Date "1974"] [White "Anatoly Karpov"] [Black "Michael Basman"] 1.e4 g6 2.d4 Bg7 3.Nc3 d6 4.Be3 a6 5.Qd2 b5 6.f3 Nd7 7.h4 h5 8.Nh3 Nb6 9.Ng5 f6 10.Nh3 Bxh3 11.Rxh3 e6 12.Bd3 Ne7 13.Ne2 Qd7 14.O-O-O f5 15.exf5 exf5 16.Nf4 O-O-O 17.Rg3 Rhg8 18.Nxg6 Nxg6 19.Rxg6 Qf7 20.Rxg7 Rxg7 21.Bg5 Re8 22.Qa5 Kb7 23.a4 Nc4 24.Qb4 c6 25.d5 c5 26.Qb3 Nb6 27.axb5 a5 28.Qc3 Ra8 29.Bh6 Rxg2 30.Bf4 Qd7 31.Qf6 c4 32.Bxf5 Qxb5 33.Qe7+ Ka6 34.Bxd6 c3 35.Bd3 Nc4 36.b3 Rc8 37.Qe6 Kb7 38.bxc4 Qb2# 0-1

This game is a great example of Basman's imaginative and creative play style. He opens with the unusual move 1...g6, which sets the stage for a game full of unconventional ideas. Throughout the game, he sacrifices material to gain positional advantages, and his attacking play eventually leads to a stunning victory against one of the greatest players of all time.

Is this complete hogwash? If so, who played this game?

[Roger de Coverly]

I[Event "Luton"]
[Date "1974"]
Is this complete hogwash? If so, who played this game?

I cannot find evidence of either Karpov or Basman reaching the Tiger Modern position of this game or any game by anyone that matches the later play.

Given that Luton 1974 is unlikely to have reached major databases, that could account for the absence. Of the two, it's only Basman who may have played at Luton in 1974 and the Tiger Modern sequence was known at that time in England as Botterill had played it in 1971 at Hastings. Also Keene played it in the 1974 Olympiad.

[Matt Mackenzie]

The likelihood of Karpov playing in a weekend tournament in 1974 in Luton is, shall we say, not terribly high.

[NickFaulks]

The likelihood of Karpov playing in a weekend tournament in 1974 in Luton is, shall we say, not terribly high.

I played at Luton 1974, my first ever weekend Swiss. Basman may well have been there, since he was everywhere around then, but I think I would have remembered Karpov.

[IM Jack Rudd]

I imagine the likelihood of Karpov's playing The Worst Move On The Board on move 38 there also isn't particularly high.

[Matt Mackenzie]

Well that alone intrigues me as to who the opponent actually *was*.

(if not Karpov, then some pretty strong players could still make a clanger like that in time trouble)

[Tim Harding]

If we apply the toughest criteria - a win at classical time control against a reigning world champion I think I have six:
Lasker-Blackburne, Hastings 1895
Lasker-Blackburne, London 1899
Penrose-Tal, Liepzig 1960
Karpov-Miles Skara 1980
Short-Kasparov Brussels 1984
Short-Kasparov London 1993

Looking back at this old thread, I think nobody including me previously pointed out that the fifth item in the above list is invalid.
Kasparov did not become world champion until the 9th of November 1985, when he won Game 24 of his second match with Karpov.

In relation to David McAlister's query back in 2018, also unanswered, about whether any English/British player defeated one of the winners of FIDE's knockout championships while they were technically the "reigning world champion", I can offer Nigel Short's training match with Ponomariov in the summer of 2003. At that time Ponomariov was still hoping to get a match with Kasparov and Nigel went to Yalta.
I don't have the complete result or know the time limit but it was probably classical as Ponomariov was training for a classical match.

I do know that Nigel won both Game 6 and Game 8 employing the Evans Gambit.

One of those games was included on a Nigel Short's Greatest Hits DVD for ChessBase and eventually he annotated them both in print in the column he used to write for New In Chess (no 8 of 2016 and no 6 of 2018 if my notes are correct). Possibly they are not in standard databases.

[Matt Mackenzie]

Well its not *really* invalid because Short actually beat Kasparov at Brussels 198*6* (not 1984)

[Matt Bridgeman]

Anyone want to have a go at English victories against these World Champions - Khalifman (FIDE Las Vegas 1999), Ponomariov (FIDE Moscow 2001), Kasimdzhanov (FIDE Tripoli 2004) and Topalov (FIDE San Luis 2005)?

I'm guessing the answer will be mainly Adams! Lol A light check for one - Ponomariov 1-1 with Adams at Linares 2002. I think he also recorded only one classical win against Karpov, which was Dortmund in 1994, but that was in Karpov's 1993-1999 FIDE reign. And I can throw in Sadler v Khalifman from Bundesliga 2000.

[Nick Ivell]

The idea of Karpov playing at Luton is absurd.

I don't think he ever played in a weekend Swiss.