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Caro Kann Breyer variation
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2024 2:30 am
by MJMcCready
What's the main reason why people play 1. e4 e6 2. d3? Is it just to avoid theory? Do any GM's play this with regularity? Did anyone ever?
Re: Caro Kann Breyer variation
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2024 11:16 am
by John Upham
MJMcCready wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2024 2:30 am
What's the main reason why people play 1. e4 e6 2. d3? Is it just to avoid theory? Do any GM's play this with regularity? Did anyone ever?
Presumably as a route toward a King's Indian Attack.
The KIA is particularly favoured in lines where Black has not played e5 in one move so ...e6 will suit the KIA player.
Re: Caro Kann Breyer variation
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2024 11:57 am
by NickFaulks
Is this about the French or the CK?
Re: Caro Kann Breyer variation
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2024 12:48 pm
by Jon D'Souza-Eva
I sometimes play 2.d3 against the Caro-Kann in online bullet and blitz games but only with the intention of playing this dodgy and very well known trap:
Re: Caro Kann Breyer variation
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2024 12:59 pm
by Peter Ackley
NickFaulks wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2024 11:57 am
Is this about the French or the CK?
I think the point is there are lines with ... c6 and ... d5 where black plays ... e6 which could equally arise via ... e6, ... d5 and ... c6.
As someone who plays 1.Nf3 I sometimes get Breyer variation (or variationesque) positions via transposition. The honest answer as to why I like them is:
(a) I like the structure as white
(b) it's not as theoretical as the mainlines and I don't have the time to devote to learning reams of theory
(c) black players sometimes find the positions less to their taste compared to the main line.
It doesn't mean I think the line is best as white - indeed with unlimited time and resources I'd quite like to be playing the advance vs the Caro Kann - but Breyer structures suit where I am in my life, and chess life, right now.
Re: Caro Kann Breyer variation
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2024 2:13 pm
by John Upham
Peter Ackley wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2024 12:59 pm
As someone who plays 1.Nf3 I sometimes get Breyer variation (or variationesque) positions via transposition.
The plus side of attempting a Breyer / KIA via 1.Nf3 is that a 1.e4 move order allows 1...d5 which is not so convenient for the KIA player.
Re: Caro Kann Breyer variation
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2024 2:22 pm
by John Upham
Jon D'Souza-Eva wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2024 12:48 pm
I sometimes play 2.d3 against the Caro-Kann in online bullet and blitz games but only with the intention of playing this dodgy and very well known trap:
What is White doing after 5...Nd7 rather than 5...Nf6?
Re: Caro Kann Breyer variation
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2024 3:06 pm
by Matt Mackenzie
Like many such openings, it can be dangerous if Black hasn't prepared for it or takes things casually.
Leonid Stein got some nice wins with it as White, back in the day.
Re: Caro Kann Breyer variation
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2024 3:08 pm
by MJMcCready
John Upham wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2024 11:16 am
MJMcCready wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2024 2:30 am
What's the main reason why people play 1. e4 e6 2. d3? Is it just to avoid theory? Do any GM's play this with regularity? Did anyone ever?
Presumably as a route toward a King's Indian Attack.
The KIA is particularly favoured in lines where Black has not played e5 in one move so ...e6 will suit the KIA player.
That's what I initially thought as well as main line theory avoidance.
Re: Caro Kann Breyer variation
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2024 3:08 pm
by MJMcCready
Matt Mackenzie wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2024 3:06 pm
Like many such openings, it can be dangerous if Black hasn't prepared for it or takes things casually.
Leonid Stein got some nice wins with it as White, back in the day.
Thanks, I like him, I will take a look.
Re: Caro Kann Breyer variation
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2024 3:35 pm
by John Upham
Re: Caro Kann Breyer variation
Posted: Mon Mar 11, 2024 5:32 pm
by MJMcCready
Thanks.
Re: Caro Kann Breyer variation
Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2024 6:10 am
by MJMcCready
Peter Ackley wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2024 12:59 pm
NickFaulks wrote: ↑Mon Mar 11, 2024 11:57 am
Is this about the French or the CK?
I think the point is there are lines with ... c6 and ... d5 where black plays ... e6 which could equally arise via ... e6, ... d5 and ... c6.
As someone who plays 1.Nf3 I sometimes get Breyer variation (or variationesque) positions via transposition. The honest answer as to why I like them is:
(a) I like the structure as white
(b) it's not as theoretical as the mainlines and I don't have the time to devote to learning reams of theory
(c) black players sometimes find the positions less to their taste compared to the main line.
It doesn't mean I think the line is best as white - indeed with unlimited time and resources I'd quite like to be playing the advance vs the Caro Kann - but Breyer structures suit where I am in my life, and chess life, right now.
Thanks, I've had a good look at it and found some of Leonid Stein's games with it. He always plays b4 and then often fianchettoes the queen's Bishop. Is this an important thing to do in that opening? Why?