Alekhine with f3

Technical questions regarding Openings, Middlegames, Endings etc.
Gavin Hughes
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Alekhine with f3

Post by Gavin Hughes » Thu Aug 17, 2017 11:38 pm

Apart from leaving a few potential holes around e3 and g3 if Alekhine players face this often and general experiences? 1. E4 Nf6 2. F3

Just curious.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Alekhine with f3

Post by Roger de Coverly » Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:08 am

Gavin Hughes wrote:Apart from leaving a few potential holes around e3 and g3 if Alekhine players face this often and general experiences? 1. E4 Nf6 2. F3
Mike Surtees used to use a similar idea in the c3 Sicilian. 1. e4 c5 2. c3 Nf6/d5 3 f3 . He seems to have abandoned it in favour of 1. e4 c5 2. Nh3 .

Feel free to give 1. e4 Nf6 2. f3 a punt .

There's around 30 previous games if you want research material, none of them played in English tournaments.

Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Alekhine with f3

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Fri Aug 18, 2017 10:22 am

A club colleague has tried 1.e4 Nf6, 2.f3 and it seems to work ok. Hardly anybody plays 1....Nf6 anyway, so he doesn't get too many opportunities, but the Black confuser frequently becomes the confusee.

Jonathan Rogers
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Re: Alekhine with f3

Post by Jonathan Rogers » Fri Aug 18, 2017 11:25 am

It's evidently playable. But why play it? It has no evidemt purpose and sets no traps, so is quite low down the scale of wacky ideas. It is just proof that White can get away with a pointless move or two in the opening.

LawrenceCooper
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Re: Alekhine with f3

Post by LawrenceCooper » Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:14 pm

Jonathan Rogers wrote:It's evidently playable. But why play it? It has no evidemt purpose and sets no traps, so is quite low down the scale of wacky ideas. It is just proof that White can get away with a pointless move or two in the opening.
Maybe the plan is to answer 2...e5 with 3 f4 and to have a reversed Latvian Gambit :D

Jonathan Rogers
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Re: Alekhine with f3

Post by Jonathan Rogers » Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:04 pm

And in the event of a cunning 2...d5, 3 d4 dxe4 4 Nc3 with a Blackmar-Diemer Gambit!

NickFaulks
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Re: Alekhine with f3

Post by NickFaulks » Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:12 pm

Jonathan Rogers wrote:And in the event of a cunning 2...d5, 3 d4 dxe4 4 Nc3 with a Blackmar-Diemer Gambit!
Or 3.e5, Nfd7 4.d4, e6 5.Be3 and we've transposed to one of the better lines in the Tromp.

After 2...e5, though, I really do think White is looking for a way to equalise - Lawrence's idea notwithstanding.

LawrenceCooper
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Re: Alekhine with f3

Post by LawrenceCooper » Fri Aug 18, 2017 1:40 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
Jonathan Rogers wrote:And in the event of a cunning 2...d5, 3 d4 dxe4 4 Nc3 with a Blackmar-Diemer Gambit!
Or 3.e5, Nfd7 4.d4, e6 5.Be3 and we've transposed to one of the better lines in the Tromp.

After 2...e5, though, I really do think White is looking for a way to equalise - Lawrence's idea notwithstanding.
Agreed. One of the many drawbacks to f3 can be seen after 3 Bc4 d5 4 ed Nd5 where 5 Ne2 is met by Qh4+ and the bishop on c4 drops off.

Gavin Hughes
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Re: Alekhine with f3

Post by Gavin Hughes » Fri Aug 18, 2017 3:17 pm

thanks all for your thoughts. maybe nc3 first then :)

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Matt Mackenzie
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Re: Alekhine with f3

Post by Matt Mackenzie » Fri Aug 18, 2017 3:20 pm

2 Bc4 is another offbeat line - it isn't objectively very good, but might bamboozle the unwary.
"Set up your attacks so that when the fire is out, it isn't out!" (H N Pillsbury)

Paul Dargan
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Re: Alekhine with f3

Post by Paul Dargan » Fri Aug 18, 2017 9:57 pm

Or 2.d3 and 3.f4

Gavin Hughes
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Re: Alekhine with f3

Post by Gavin Hughes » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:21 am

Paul Dargan wrote:Or 2.d3 and 3.f4
I have played for this set up before with nc3 first moving into a Vienna. However many Alekhine players play d5 after nc3 and you end up playing e5 (exd is probably ok as well but probably less challenging)

Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Alekhine with f3

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Mon Aug 21, 2017 1:17 pm

"Maybe the plan is to answer 2...e5 with 3 f4 and to have a reversed Latvian Gambit "

That's the one - and you are not even a move behind. At normal club level, it sets great problems.

NickFaulks
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Re: Alekhine with f3

Post by NickFaulks » Mon Aug 21, 2017 1:33 pm

If that's what you want, you're more likely to get it by starting 1.e3, hoping for 1...e5 2.e4, Nf6.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Alekhine with f3

Post by Roger de Coverly » Mon Aug 21, 2017 2:12 pm

Kevin Thurlow wrote:At normal club level, it sets great problems.
For the player who moves the f pawn that is.

Here's one I played earlier (county match in 1999)



You're supposed to play 3. .. Qf6

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