22th European Team Chess Championship 2019

[JustinHorton]

Oh, that's interesting, because from those figures it looked like David (and the team) did indeed need to win.

[Alex Holowczak]

Oh, that's interesting, because from those figures it looked like David (and the team) did indeed need to win.

But as I say, TB2 will change because some games are still ongoing.

[Alex Holowczak]

Oh, that's interesting, because from those figures it looked like David (and the team) did indeed need to win.

But as I say, TB2 will change because some games are still ongoing.

Actually, it probably won't since all of England and Armenia's mutual opponents seem to have finished.

If England drew their match, then Armenia would have been ahead of England 221-215.5.

I predicted that England drawing and Armenia winning would be close, but England would be more likely to win it; especially if the Czechs beat the French. The Czechs drew with the French; had France won, we would have been fine. There is one interesting scenario: If the Dutch won 2.5-1.5 against Georgia, and England drew, then Armenia would still have prevailed 221-220.5. Actually, in this scenario, Germany and Croatia would be exactly tied for 5th; they would not have been separated by the three tie-breaks.

So I think I can conclude that my suggestion last night England would be OK for third on tie-break with a 2-2 draw was just wrong; obviously the random but reasonable results I put in didn't explore enough different options, although I correctly identified France v Czech Republic as the match that would most impact upon that. The male commentator spoke with great certainty that England would beat Armenia on tie-break.

But enough of my rambling about tie-breaks; well done to the whole team, and it was a good job David won.

[Keith Arkell]

If England drew their match, then Armenia would have been ahead of England 221-215.5.

I predicted that England drawing and Armenia winning would be close, but England would be more likely to win it; especially if the Czechs beat the French. The Czechs drew with the French; had France won, we would have been fine. There is one interesting scenario: If the Dutch won 2.5-1.5 against Georgia, and England drew, then Armenia would still have prevailed 221-220.5. Actually, in this scenario, Germany and Croatia would be exactly tied for 5th; they would not have been separated by the three tie-breaks.

So I think I can conclude that my suggestion last night England would be OK for third on tie-break with a 2-2 draw was just wrong; obviously the random but reasonable results I put in didn't explore enough different options, although I correctly identified France v Czech Republic as the match that would most impact upon that. The male commentator spoke with great certainty that England would beat Armenia on tie-break.

But enough of my rambling about tie-breaks; well done to the whole team, and it was a good job David won.

I wish I'd had someone like Alex on standby when I was trying to work out during play where I stood in terms of tie-break in the last round of the World Senior 5 years ago. But I guess it would in any case have been against the rules for him to communicate the valuable info to me during play.

Anyway, very well done England! It sounds like nothing special when you say that the second seeds finished 3rd, but the margins are so slim between the top dozen or so sides that in reality this was yet another terrifically powerful showing by our very impressive team.

[Alex Holowczak]

I wish I'd had someone like Alex on standby when I was trying to work out during play where I stood in terms of tie-break in the last round of the World Senior 5 years ago. But I guess it would in any case have been against the rules for him to communicate the valuable info to me during play.

Well, given that I was wrong...

[Keith Arkell]

Oops! Oh well, so was I back then!

[Ian Thompson]

I wish I'd had someone like Alex on standby when I was trying to work out during play where I stood in terms of tie-break in the last round of the World Senior 5 years ago. But I guess it would in any case have been against the rules for him to communicate the valuable info to me during play.

I'd agree it would be wrong for someone to volunteer the information to you. I don't see anything wrong with you asking the question and being told the answer.

[David Sedgwick]

I'd agree it would be wrong for someone to volunteer the information to you. I don't see anything wrong with you asking the question and being told the answer.

During play in the last round of the London Chess Classic 2017, Magnus Carlsen asked whether a draw would suffice for him to win the Grand Chess Tour after all. After checking the answer, I conferred with Albert Vasse, the event Chief Arbiter, and we agreed that we should give him the answer, which was Yes.

Carlsen went on to defeat his opponent Aronian anyway.

[David Sedgwick]

Anyway, very well done England! It sounds like nothing special when you say that the second seeds finished 3rd, but the margins are so slim between the top dozen or so sides that in reality this was yet another terrifically powerful showing by our very impressive team.

I entirely concur. This was the third excellent result in succession by the England Open Team, after several years of disappointing performances.

To my mind, the unlucky team were Armenia. All five of their players obtained plus scores and all five gained rating points. That didn't suffice for a team medal of any colour.

[Jonathan Rogers]

...

Anyway, very well done England! It sounds like nothing special when you say that the second seeds finished 3rd, but the margins are so slim between the top dozen or so sides that in reality this was yet another terrifically powerful showing by our very impressive team.

Thin margins all right. The top four all made exactly the same number of gamepoints!! The like of which has not been seen since Guildford, Sambuca Sharks, Barbican 1 and Barbican 2 all made exactly the same gamepoints in the 4NCL rapidplay in 2014!

(Although it is easier to identify where Russia and Ukraine could/should have picked up more matchpoints and gamepoints, so no denying the exact finishing positions).

Three events without Nigel Short: three excellent results. Coincidence? i am sure that Malcolm couldn't possibly comment.

[Richard Bates]

Anyway, very well done England! It sounds like nothing special when you say that the second seeds finished 3rd, but the margins are so slim between the top dozen or so sides that in reality this was yet another terrifically powerful showing by our very impressive team.

I entirely concur. This was the third excellent result in succession by the England Open Team, after several years of disappointing performances.

To my mind, the unlucky team were Armenia. All five of their players obtained plus scores and all five gained rating points. That didn't suffice for a medal of any colour.

Silver on board 1?

[JustinHorton]

Three events without Nigel Short: three excellent results. Coincidence? i am sure that Malcolm couldn't possibly comment.

Me neither, but I do note it was a tournament basically played without a board five - not because Nick didn't play well when he was called upon, but because he wasn't called upon more than twice. I wonder if this was always the plan.

[David Sedgwick]

… To my mind, the unlucky team were Armenia. All five of their players obtained plus scores and all five gained rating points. That didn't suffice for a medal of any colour.

Silver on board 1?

I intended to refer to Armenia not getting a team medal. I have edited my post accordingly.

[David Sedgwick]

Three events without Nigel Short: three excellent results. Coincidence? i am sure that Malcolm couldn't possibly comment.

Me neither, but I do note it was a tournament basically played without a board five - not because Nick didn't play well when he was called upon, but because he wasn't called upon more than twice. I wonder if this was always the plan.

I don't know, but I imagine so.

[Mick Norris]

...

Anyway, very well done England! It sounds like nothing special when you say that the second seeds finished 3rd, but the margins are so slim between the top dozen or so sides that in reality this was yet another terrifically powerful showing by our very impressive team.

Thin margins all right. The top four all made exactly the same number of gamepoints!! The like of which has not been seen since Guildford, Sambuca Sharks, Barbican 1 and Barbican 2 all made exactly the same gamepoints in the 4NCL rapidplay in 2014!

(Although it is easier to identify where Russia and Ukraine could/should have picked up more matchpoints and gamepoints, so no denying the exact finishing positions).

Three events without Nigel Short: three excellent results. Coincidence? i am sure that Malcolm couldn't possibly comment.

Yes very good overall result and a consistent pattern emerging; well done to the team; nice to see David winning today after a slightly disappointing event although he must have been drained by the IoM (and I was surprised not to see him given a day off early on like Luke & Gawain)

Much better than the rugby, of which fortunately I missed the last half hour (and the shambles in Newcastle-under-Lyme )