Reply to Roger!

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Carl Hibbard
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Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by Carl Hibbard » Wed Mar 19, 2014 3:25 pm

I think the criticism is harsh to be honest.
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Carl Hibbard

Andrew Camp
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Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by Andrew Camp » Wed Mar 19, 2014 3:35 pm

Another day on the forum.


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Colm Daly
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Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by Colm Daly » Wed Mar 19, 2014 4:37 pm

David Sedgwick wrote:
IM Jack Rudd wrote:This topic has been moved to International News.
I'm beginning to wonder if it should have been not just moved, but closed or deleted.

Those who don't like what Roger has to say have the option of adding him to their foes lists. That will save them a lot of time when catching up with the Forum.
Jeez David, you don't like what people are saying so hey just delete it? Is that really what you are saying? Or have I misunderstood you?

Roger simply should not have presumed to think he could ever know anything of real insight about Irish chess no more than I would about English Chess and then proceed to insult me, misrepresent me, distort and selectively ignore what I post when it conflicts with his own perspective, only then to complain when I react by assiduously refuting point by point his ill informed notions. In other words, when he is shown to be ill-informed and in some cases plain wrong then it is just a rant?

I have the distinct feeling the Roger is indeed a mine of information on all manner of things, in particular, English chess, but perhaps more in the sense of fact and figures, knowledge spanning many years of experience which should rightfully be appreciated. But in terms of the views and perspectives offered by Roger, well just taking things on face value on my little experience so far in here, I would suggest that there is plenty of scope for scrutiny and at times even skepticism as to the real value of such perspectives. It is simply not possible for any of us to be right all the time.

So, rant or not I did not start or set out to discuss Irish chess and I was indeed mistaken to allow myself be provoked by a few nasty and ignorant comments.

http://www.ecforum.org.uk/viewtopic.php ... 60#p134482

http://www.ecforum.org.uk/viewtopic.php ... 60#p134601

The weakness of my own character is of course the impulse to respond and correct things. A vain endeavor at the best of times.

As Martin has said, I was a big fool to have allowed myself to be sucked into any discussion on Irish chess here on ECF. It was never my intent, and it is arguably inappropriate. I came on here originally on the back of a story of international interest relating to the whole Andrew Paulson drama which contained many topical issues that had wider relevance to chess and how chess is run at times, or how things get done behind the scenes etc. Plus there was the whole issue of the Fide elections and... etc etc.

Anyway I thought I made some witty and even perhaps interesting comments that might have some value and curiosity, especially given that I was just giving one view as an outsider looking in on English chess. And as it happens I have always had a great interest in and fascination with English history and culture, with plenty of fond memories of visiting England, and even playing some chess tournaments there over the years too, not to mention a huge affinity for English pop/rock music and the great works of English literature. So I indulged myself by making some comments, being careful to be respectful of the fact that I was actually a guest/outsider and should show certain decorum.

All good so far, no harm, no problem. A few laughs and some banter.

Then.... It all went to hell? Which is my fault entirely for indulging my frustration and exasperation in the face of manifestly ill informed and distorted views with a latent hint of malice, or at least ill will.......

http://www.ecforum.org.uk/viewtopic.php ... 75#p134615

http://www.ecforum.org.uk/viewtopic.php ... 75#p134637

If I continue on it will for sure be classed as another rant [Assume it already has been].

I bid you farewell
Apologies for any discord caused on my account and I wish you all well.

Mike Truran
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Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by Mike Truran » Fri Mar 21, 2014 11:40 pm

Well, that all went well. Another triumph for ecforum dialogue.

John McKenna

Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by John McKenna » Sat Mar 22, 2014 12:08 am

If I had to choose just one line from all of the above to reflect the nature of the debate it'd be -

Colm Daly>Sorry, but maybe I am just tired, but I have no idea what you are on about with this.<

The impression of butting one's head against a brick wall comes through - literally.

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Patrick McGovern
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Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by Patrick McGovern » Fri Mar 28, 2014 3:15 pm

I actually enjoyed Colm's "rant". Far from being a rant it was a well thought out, reasoned and balanced argument. The responses he drew from Roger were the opposite of that. This disappointed me as I have observed Roger debating vigorously and accurately on other topics. 1-0 to Colm
A rook on the second is like a bone in the throat - Fischer

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by Roger de Coverly » Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:28 pm

This is from the dublinchess website of over ten years ago.

http://web.archive.org/web/200502040029 ... otion%2025

It's a copy of an email from GM Baburin
Alex Baburin wrote:When I came to Ireland in 1993, I naturally had nothing against Mr Daly. But I started winning local tournaments, which he did not like. I became his 'enemy'. Later several Irish players surpassed him, so they joined the club - primarily IMs Quinn, Heidenfeld and Orr. I bet that Sam Collins is also well on his way to his 'club' of evil forces of the Irish chess.The truth is that Cold Daly has hard time making it on the national team and wants to knock down a few players from it. His favourite strategy is to throw as much mud at people as possible, hoping that some of it might stick.


Alex Baburin is also a figure in English chess, playing in tournaments and the 4NCL. I don't know that he had made any particular enemies or got a bad reputation, unlike one or two names that spring to mind.

Colm Daly
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Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by Colm Daly » Fri Mar 28, 2014 8:09 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote:This is from the dublinchess website of over ten years ago.

http://web.archive.org/web/200502040029 ... otion%2025

It's a copy of an email from GM Baburin
Alex Baburin wrote:When I came to Ireland in 1993, I naturally had nothing against Mr Daly. But I started winning local tournaments, which he did not like. I became his 'enemy'. Later several Irish players surpassed him, so they joined the club - primarily IMs Quinn, Heidenfeld and Orr. I bet that Sam Collins is also well on his way to his 'club' of evil forces of the Irish chess.The truth is that Cold Daly has hard time making it on the national team and wants to knock down a few players from it. His favourite strategy is to throw as much mud at people as possible, hoping that some of it might stick.


Alex Baburin is also a figure in English chess, playing in tournaments and the 4NCL. I don't know that he had made any particular enemies or got a bad reputation, unlike one or two names that spring to mind.
Yes Roger and it is well established within Irish chess that sometimes poor auld Alex writes and talks utter rubbish- only sometimes to be fair. Stuff that can be refuted as factually incorrect. I had a harder time getting on the national team by virtue of him being a selector at times, but other than that, it was not an issue for me.

Honestly Roger I think you should refrain from spewing out half truths. and propaganda. As I have already said, you do not know what you are talking about. Simple as that really. A little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

If you had been in any way balanced or well informed you would have given my reply to that piece if nonsense from Mr Baburin. It was not the first nor the last time he wrote such rubbish. But exactly why you would now be involving yourself in things of which you know next to nothing is odd. Mr Baburin plays in the 4NCL other than that he has not and does not play chess in England period. Last time perhaps being in the British Ch and the Isle Of Man = long time ago. BTW I have played in 2 or 3 British Championships and the odd weekender like Blackpool! 20 plus years ago. Last time I played in England was also well over a decade ago. Other than two games against Richard Bates in the London Lgs.

You will no doubt simply tell me that I am ranting when I refute point by point any rubbish you dig up and try throw around. You are now starting to go in the direction of a stalker. I take the blame and even apologized for ever allowing myself be sucked in to any discussion by provocative and nasty little comments. I could literally write a book on the nonsense that has gone on here and be vindicated for about 90 percent of my own role, because yes I am no angel and have even made errors of judgement, and even been wrong about some things, But not very often or by much. Come to Ireland Dear Roger ask around, get the perspective of a lot more people other than just me or Mr Baburin. But better still, just drop it! Leave it alone and accept it neither a good idea or appropriate for you to involve yourself in matters about which you simply could not know or understand much worth posting on any website.

If all the facts and perspectives about what went on were known within Irish chess over the past 20 plus years and people were simply neutral then even people like you would have to admit you are so wrong about so many things. But of course you are not interested in the truth about issues so much as somehow convincing yourself that you are not so ill informed and ignorant about certain matters as you most assuredly are.

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Carl Hibbard
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Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by Carl Hibbard » Fri Mar 28, 2014 8:30 pm

There is a limit to the one side ranting I will allow Colm and you have reached it :roll:
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Roger de Coverly
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Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by Roger de Coverly » Fri Mar 28, 2014 8:36 pm

Colm Daly wrote: If you had been in any way balanced or well informed you would have given my reply to that piece if nonsense from Mr Baburin. It was not the first nor the last time he wrote such rubbish.
Here was the reply
http://web.archive.org/web/200412061244 ... mania.html

The anti-Daly conspiracies were at one of their peaks round about this period.
dublinchess.com wrote:As to the list of people he says I "attacked", well of course what he doesn't mention is that every one of these people has at one time or other been in a position of power over me, have all tried to get at me in very vicious ways, and I have never been in any position of power over any of these people

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Carl Hibbard
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Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by Carl Hibbard » Fri Mar 28, 2014 8:38 pm

Enough now??
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Michael Yeo
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Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by Michael Yeo » Fri Mar 28, 2014 10:11 pm

Colm Daly wrote: Last time I played in England was also well over a decade ago. Other than two games against Richard Bates in the London Lgs.
Are you really not the player who played in the European Union Championships in Liverpool in 2008? The thought that there could be 2 of you is quite worrying.

Colm Daly
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Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by Colm Daly » Fri Mar 28, 2014 10:36 pm

Michael Yeo wrote:
Colm Daly wrote: Last time I played in England was also well over a decade ago. Other than two games against Richard Bates in the London Lgs.
Are you really not the player who played in the European Union Championships in Liverpool in 2008? The thought that there could be 2 of you is quite worrying.
Yes that was me, fantastic! I forgot about that in the moment I was writing! Had a bad tournament so I probably wanted to forget about it on some level or other. Had a nice time in Liverpool though. Event was excellently done too.

Don't think I am overlooking any other events? I played in the Isle of Man events but that was more than ten years too.

Colm Daly
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Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by Colm Daly » Fri Mar 28, 2014 10:37 pm

Carl Hibbard wrote:There is a limit to the one side ranting I will allow Colm and you have reached it :roll:
Carl, on March 19 I wrote my last response on this this thread, apologized for any discord caused on my account. Pointed out how it was not me who started this very unpleasant and frankly pointless, exchange, or at any rate, inappropriate topic for this website.

I freely acknowledged that I had been a fool to have allowed myself be provoked and dragged into a silly exchange in which it would be impossible for the likes of Roger to be in any way well placed to be making comments on Irish chess or me. Pointed out that the same would be true for me to be making comments on events or issues which took place within English chess.

I hoped that would be the end of the matter but then tonight I see Roger decide to literally dig up things from years ago, in a manner frankly that could indeed leave one with an impression of a stalker at work, and then once again have a go and just make a one sided attack on me.

Now I reply again to point out the absurdness of this and you tell me I am on a one sided rant? Fair enough, if that is how you think, then there is nothing I can do about that. Not sure that there is any point in my posting anything one way or the other.

I stand by my posts, and indeed the stuff from all those years ago, but I don't see how they have anything to do with English chess and or why someone whom I have no doubt has much knowledge and experience of English chess, but next to nothing of Irish chess – save for what is on the internet, is so keen to bang a particular drum.

I agree, enough is enough.

Colm Daly
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Re: Reply to Roger!

Post by Colm Daly » Fri Mar 28, 2014 11:02 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote:
dublinchess.com wrote:As to the list of people he says I "attacked", well of course what he doesn't mention is that every one of these people has at one time or other been in a position of power over me, have all tried to get at me in very vicious ways, and I have never been in any position of power over any of these people
I guess a difference between yourself and myself Roger is perhaps underscored by the fact that I would have given the rest of the paragraph as a quote. You see, we can all selectively quote and counter quote, but the idea is that sometimes people see what they want to see and overlook things that offer a bit more balance.
dublinchess.com wrote: That I was/am very critical of they way I feel (and I believe many others too) they have abused their positions of trust and power certainly is not something I have ever felt any need to apologize for. At the end of the day I had also never denied much of the good qualities of all of these people, not all of whom are so inclined to hold a grudge so much as to prevent some kind of understanding and reciprocal civility. Time should heal some wounds and people should be able to have differences without having to be forced to never have some kind of accommodation with each other.
As someone has already pointed out, I am a fool indeed to be wasting my time on this nonsense. Anyway Kasparov is coming on the TV here in Ireland in a few moments and I will need my beauty sleep if I am to go to the function tomorrow.

http://www.icu.ie/misc/bulletins/kasparov_2014_en.pdf