Olympiad

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JustinHorton
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Re: Olympiad

Post by JustinHorton » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:24 pm

Paul Dargan wrote:
JustinHorton wrote: ... I don't suppose there's any chance Glud lost on time?
Playing David?

Paul
Heh.

Actually it was a stupid question on my part, but I'm kind of a night's sleep away from functioning properly.

Which reminds me of something I asked on Twitter without any luck. Have any of the competitors complained of problems sleeping due to the extremely truncated night?
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

lostontime.blogspot.com

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Carl Hibbard
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Re: Olympiad

Post by Carl Hibbard » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:25 pm

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:
Simon Brown wrote:Pretty easy win from here, not too early to resign I'd say. But you know my thoughts about that subject......
Howell's game? Let's take a closer look...



Computer line is: 58. Re2+ Kf6 59. Rg2 Kg5 60. Kd6 Nf5+ 61. Ke5 Kg4 62. Ra2 Nxg3 63. Kf6 h4 64. Ra4+ Kh5 65. Ra5+ Kh6 66. Kxf7 g5 67. Ra3 g4 68. Kf6 Nh5+ 69. Kf5 g3 70. Ra6+ Kg7 71. Kg5 h3 72. Ra7+ Kh8 73. Ra8+ Kg7 74. Ra7+ Kh8 75. Ra8+ Kg7 76. Ra7+.

[Sorry, not sure how to get that in a playable format].

How do you improve on that?
My mom could win with black here.
Cheers
Carl Hibbard

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Olympiad

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:27 pm

Carl Hibbard wrote:
Christopher Kreuzer wrote:
Simon Brown wrote:Pretty easy win from here, not too early to resign I'd say. But you know my thoughts about that subject......
Howell's game? Let's take a closer look...



Computer line is: 58. Re2+ Kf6 59. Rg2 Kg5 60. Kd6 Nf5+ 61. Ke5 Kg4 62. Ra2 Nxg3 63. Kf6 h4 64. Ra4+ Kh5 65. Ra5+ Kh6 66. Kxf7 g5 67. Ra3 g4 68. Kf6 Nh5+ 69. Kf5 g3 70. Ra6+ Kg7 71. Kg5 h3 72. Ra7+ Kh8 73. Ra8+ Kg7 74. Ra7+ Kh8 75. Ra8+ Kg7 76. Ra7+.

[Sorry, not sure how to get that in a playable format].

How do you improve on that?
My mom could win with black here.
So what should Black play in that line to avoid the perpetual? I saw one line where the Black knight, on the side of the board, get trapped by its own pawns and the White king coming round the back. Little nuances like that might be the reason for the computer assessment. If the Black knight wasn't on the side of the board, it would indeed be completely winning for Black.

Simon Brown
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Re: Olympiad

Post by Simon Brown » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:27 pm

You improve on that by forgetting your computer, or at least set it to a sensible level. 58..Kf5 is an improvement as well. Then take the g pawn, using N if necessary and queen a pawn. The line you give is nonsense, unless you are playing to draw. My son, highest grade 3, thought that Black was winning.

Andy Stoker
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Re: Olympiad

Post by Andy Stoker » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:29 pm

Or Geoffrey Boycott's mum - whilst bowling out the Indian middle order with the other hand

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Olympiad

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:32 pm

Simon Brown wrote:You improve on that by forgetting your computer, or at least set it to a sensible level. 58..Kf5 is an improvement as well. Then take the g pawn, using N if necessary and queen a pawn. The line you give is nonsense, unless you are playing to draw. My son, highest grade 3, thought that Black was winning.
I suspected the line was nonsense, but you were the first person to actually suggest an alternative move. No need to bring your son into this (or people's grades), let alone long-suffering Geoffrey Boycott's mum. :D
Last edited by Christopher Kreuzer on Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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JustinHorton
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Re: Olympiad

Post by JustinHorton » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:33 pm

I notice there's an Arkell Ending still in progress in Panama v Yemen.
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

lostontime.blogspot.com

Lewis Martin
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Re: Olympiad

Post by Lewis Martin » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:33 pm

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:
Simon Brown wrote:Pretty easy win from here, not too early to resign I'd say. But you know my thoughts about that subject......
Howell's game? Let's take a closer look...



Computer line is: 58. Re2+ Kf6 59. Rg2 Kg5 60. Kd6 Nf5+ 61. Ke5 Kg4 62. Ra2 Nxg3 63. Kf6 h4 64. Ra4+ Kh5 65. Ra5+ Kh6 66. Kxf7 g5 67. Ra3 g4 68. Kf6 Nh5+ 69. Kf5 g3 70. Ra6+ Kg7 71. Kg5 h3 72. Ra7+ Kh8 73. Ra8+ Kg7 74. Ra7+ Kh8 75. Ra8+ Kg7 76. Ra7+.

[Sorry, not sure how to get that in a playable format].

How do you improve on that?
58...Kf6. Oh really? 58...Kf5 for goodness sake.

Look at the bl**dy position. Tell me how White can defend the g-pawn after the black king advancing to it via f5, g4, f3 (and if necessary, Kf2 should the rook retreat to g1). If the White rook then tries to occupy the third rank to prevent this, via a2-a3 say. (e.g. Re2 Kf5, Ra2 Kg4, Ra3) then Black plays Nh6-f5.

As for being able to get the f-pawn, ok so what, that h-pawn is going to promote since White's king is on the wrong side of the board.

Chris Rice
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Re: Olympiad

Post by Chris Rice » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:34 pm

Chris Rice wrote:
Mick Norris wrote:Bo. 39 England (ENG) Rtg - 29 Sweden (SWE) Rtg

21.1 IM Houska, Jovanka 2401 - GM Cramling, Pia 2500
21.2 WIM Maroroa, Sue 2120 - WFM Frisk, Ellinor 2257
21.3 Kalaiyalahan, Akshaya 2016 - Bengtsson, Jessica 1933
21.4 WFM James, Ann-Marie 2095 - WFM Horn, Emilia 2000

Should be an interesting match
Very true, Pia Cramling is in great form (7/8) so Jovanka's going to have her work cut out today. Their listed board 2, WIM Agrest seems to be having a 'mare of a tournament (2/7) so Frisk has taken over board 2, unfortunately she is on form (6.5/8) so Sue will be up against it as well so we'll have to hope Akshaya and Ann-Marie do the business.
2-2 with wins on 3&4 for England. Well done Akshaya & Ann-Marie.

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Olympiad

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:35 pm

Lewis Martin wrote: 58...Kf6. Oh really? 58...Kf5 for goodness sake.
Yeah. So presumably the computer is in the middle of assessing the difference between the two, and some cut-off thing forces that (inferior) line to be pushed out to the watching masses?

Lewis Martin
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Re: Olympiad

Post by Lewis Martin » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:38 pm

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:
Lewis Martin wrote: 58...Kf6. Oh really? 58...Kf5 for goodness sake.
Yeah. So presumably the computer is in the middle of assessing the difference between the two, and some cut-off thing forces that (inferior) line to be pushed out to the watching masses?
And the other argument against it being a mistake, would Howell, never mind the fella next door, not at the very least play it out?!

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JustinHorton
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Re: Olympiad

Post by JustinHorton » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:39 pm

The only other match still going is supposedly Togo v Lesotho but I reckon that last game must actually have finished.

I like to think there are now hundreds of players clustered round the crucial game in Panama v Yemen...
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

lostontime.blogspot.com

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Olympiad

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:42 pm

Lewis Martin wrote:
Christopher Kreuzer wrote:
Lewis Martin wrote: 58...Kf6. Oh really? 58...Kf5 for goodness sake.
Yeah. So presumably the computer is in the middle of assessing the difference between the two, and some cut-off thing forces that (inferior) line to be pushed out to the watching masses?
And the other argument against it being a mistake, would Howell, never mind the fella next door, not at the very least play it out?!
The 'mistake' argument supposes that a draw was agreed. If it is not a mistaken result, then it is simply a resignation. I agree that Howell would play on instead of agreeing a draw, but that is not what happened. What happened is that White resigned and we are trying to ascertain whether the computer assessment (at 0.00 at the time) was correct or not. What we really need to settle the argument is for someone to run the position on a computer for a long time and see what the final result is. If it is a win for Black (as those using their noggins are saying), then fine (on balance, I would agree that Black is winning there). But I like the slim possibility that the computer has seen some amazing drawing line.

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Carl Hibbard
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Re: Olympiad

Post by Carl Hibbard » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:45 pm

Andy Stoker wrote:Or Geoffrey Boycott's mum - whilst bowling out the Indian middle order with the other hand
India didn't bother either and moms opponent resigned.
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Carl Hibbard

John Moore
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Re: Olympiad

Post by John Moore » Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:48 pm

I don't think that I ever said that I didn't think that David was winning - just surprised his opponent resigned when he did. Incidentally, I am still not totally convinced that the White idea of bringing the king round the back is clear.

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