2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

The very latest International round up of English news.
User avatar
Matt Mackenzie
Posts: 3648
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 11:51 pm
Location: Millom, Cumbria

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by Matt Mackenzie » Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:08 pm

Jonathan Rogers wrote: I've only noticed now that Topalov never played, and I wonder why.
Hasn't he said he's done with the WC cycle?
"Set up your attacks so that when the fire is out, it isn't out!" (H N Pillsbury)

NickFaulks
Posts: 6284
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:28 pm

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by NickFaulks » Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:17 pm

Jonathan Rogers wrote:even when compared with the old interzonals?
I wasn't comparing it with anything. The interzonals ran out of steam because they were unattractive to sponsors, and a system pulling in the GP and World Cup seems to work.

I am genuinely puzzled by the mass confusion claimed by many people on and away from this forum.
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face — forever.

Jonathan Rogers
Posts: 4146
Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2008 9:26 pm

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by Jonathan Rogers » Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:32 pm

well, it's not that difficult to understand it if you keep up - but you do have to keep up and remember more than in the old days.

User avatar
JustinHorton
Posts: 8407
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:06 am
Location: Somewhere you're not

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by JustinHorton » Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:35 pm

Well for my part, it's that you're having to look at three different qualification systems at once. Which is not so hard in itself, but the additional factor that these systems influence one another is a bit on the head-spinning side.

Also, scores like 336 3/7 don't do me any favours, and I was brought up on country cricket.
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

lostontime.blogspot.com

NickFaulks
Posts: 6284
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:28 pm

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by NickFaulks » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:17 pm

JustinHorton wrote:Also, scores like 336 3/7 don't do me any favours,
The same thing happens with prize money when you get a seven way tie, that doesn't upset anyone.
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face — forever.

Jonathan Rogers
Posts: 4146
Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2008 9:26 pm

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by Jonathan Rogers » Thu Sep 07, 2017 8:30 pm

Nick, I can see why the current system may be preferable to the old interzonals, but how can you be surprised that people have trouble keeping track of what is going on, who has qualified and who has not?

We knew since last November that Karjakin would be in the candidates. Right now, we still cannot name a single additional player with any degree of confidence. Even at the end of this event, the names of the other five will still be quite in the air.

Easy to follow - not.

Steven DuCharme
Posts: 256
Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2014 11:51 pm
Location: West Bend,WI USA

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by Steven DuCharme » Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:31 pm

I don't think ratings alone should be considered for any spots in the candidates. Players must play their way in.
I float like a pawn island and sting like an ignored knight :mrgreen:

NickFaulks
Posts: 6284
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:28 pm

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by NickFaulks » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:35 pm

Steven DuCharme wrote:I don't think ratings alone should be considered for any spots in the candidates. Players must play their way in.
That is a reasonable view, but then you have to accept that the top rated challenger, who may even be universally recognised as the world #1, will not make the candidates. There is enough trouble when the right player doesn't win it and get a World Championship match.
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face — forever.

NickFaulks
Posts: 6284
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:28 pm

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by NickFaulks » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:41 pm

Jonathan Rogers wrote: Right now, we still cannot name a single additional player with any degree of confidence.
Surely that's a good thing. Don't you find that sporting competitions are generally more exciting when you don't know who is going to win?
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face — forever.

User avatar
Matt Mackenzie
Posts: 3648
Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 11:51 pm
Location: Millom, Cumbria

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by Matt Mackenzie » Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:51 pm

Demchenko has apparently said he was poorly today. If so, some of the brickbats sent his way were maybe a tad OTT.
"Set up your attacks so that when the fire is out, it isn't out!" (H N Pillsbury)

Chris Rice
Posts: 3151
Joined: Thu Nov 08, 2012 5:17 am

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by Chris Rice » Fri Sep 08, 2017 12:41 am

Sad to see Mickey go out but have to say how impressed I was in the un-Nakamura like way he graciously accepted defeat against Rodshtein who clearly didn't expect to win judging by his interview afterwards.

The Demchenko result as mentioned above is also cited in the Peter Doggers report. It was quite a shocker at the time as Kramnik said immediately afterwards "Maybe he didn't feel well, maybe he was just very impressed by me,". Kramnik will play the winner of Duda-Ivanchuk."

However, the report goes on to explain: "Demchenko had immediately escaped to his hotel room, but over the phone he explained to Chess.com: "Yesterday I was exhausted after the tiebreak. In the evening I felt ill, but in the morning it seemed to be going better. I was going to put up a fight. However, during the game I felt ill again and I realized it was impossible to play any good chess, so I offered a draw."

Anand was obviosuly disappointed to go out but his opponent Kovalyov surprisingly wasn't best pleased either because he needs to combine it with his computer science studies. "I will be really stressed now. But for now I will try to enjoy and worry later."

Karjakin's out but tbh that's not such a surprise I think, Dubov is really good and I'm wondering if the fact that Karjakin has already qualified for the Candidates took the edge out of his play. Tisdall tweeted "Last two title challengers out in the 2nd round. That's pretty scary. The format is so, so dangerous."

I'm not sure what Kuzubov was doing at the end there against Mamedyarov. That game was dead drawn 80 moves before the end and I can only think it was some sort of pyschological warfare on Kuzubov's part to try and rattle his opponent. Mamedyarov looked really annoyed at the end.

The live ratings have an amazing look at the moment. As the report shows, almost the whole top 20 is losing rating points, except for Carlsen and Svidler (and Topalov and Dominguez who aren't playing in Tbilisi).

Very few decisive results today so tomorrow we have 22 tie breaks. So it should be exciting, that's one thing about the KO format, it has plenty of thrills and spills. Carlsen tweeted "Tiebreaks are fun - it's not like spectactors are missing out from quick draws". ChessBase have just put an article up on the pros and cons of the format and what happens if Carlsen reaches the final:

Round 2 Day 2 results:

Dreev (2648) - Carlsen (2827) 0-2
Bacrot (2728) - Bu (2714) 1-1
Svidler (2756) - Erdos (2619) 1-1
Onischuk (2682) - Wojtaszek (2739) 1-1
Vachier-Lagrave (2804) - Grachev (2654) 1½-½
Tari (2588) - Lenderman (2565) ½-1½
Cori (2648) - Grischuk (2788) 1-1
Navara (2720) - Cheparinov (2695) 1-1
Kramnik (2803) - Demchenko (2650) 1½-½
Duda (2698) - Ivanchuk (2727) 1-1
Motylev (2668) - Giri (2777) 1-1
Harikrishna (2741) - Sethuraman (2617) 1-1
Hou Yifan (2670) - Aronian (2802) 1-1
Matlakov (2728) - Andreikin (2708) 1-1
Karjakin (2780) - Dubov (2666) ½-1½
Artemiev (2692) - Radjabov (2742) 1-1
So (2792) - Bluebaum (2633) 1-1
Tomashevsky (2710) - Vallejo (2717) ½-1½
Adhiban (2670) - Nepomniachtchi (2741) 1-1
Yu Yangyi 2750) - Jobava (2702) 1-1
Bruzon (2651) - Nakamura (2781) 1-1
Fedoseev (2731) - Inarkiev (2694) 1½-½
Anand (2794) - Kovalyov (2649) ½-1½
Rodshtein (2695) - Adams (2738) 1½-½
Lenic (2646) - Caruana (2799) 1-1
Vitiugov (2728) - Najer (2694) 1-1
Wei Yi (2748) - Rapport (2675) 1-1
Sevian (2610) - Li Chao (2745) 1-1
Mamedyarov (2797) - Kuzubov (2688) 1-1
Wang Hao (2701) - Gelfand (2737) 1-1
Kravtsiv (2670) - Ding Liren (2771) 1-1
Le (2739) - Vidit (2702) ½-1½

Jonathan Rogers
Posts: 4146
Joined: Tue Nov 18, 2008 9:26 pm

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by Jonathan Rogers » Fri Sep 08, 2017 7:31 am

NickFaulks wrote:
Jonathan Rogers wrote: Right now, we still cannot name a single additional player with any degree of confidence.
Surely that's a good thing. Don't you find that sporting competitions are generally more exciting when you don't know who is going to win?
Fine; all I have been saying that it is not easy to keep track of who is on course to qualify!

Mick Norris
Posts: 8520
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2007 10:12 am
Location: Bolton, Greater Manchester

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by Mick Norris » Fri Sep 08, 2017 7:40 am

Jonathan Rogers wrote:I've only just remembered that Karjakin plays in the candidates anyway, can someone more on the ball name the other so far known/very likely candidates - or is it all a mess? Is the exclusion of Anand the only notable certainty right now, perhaps?
Follow Martin Bennedik's regularly updated spreadsheet
Any postings on here represent my personal views and should not be taken as representative of the Manchester Chess Federation www.manchesterchess.co.uk

LawrenceCooper
Posts: 5412
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2011 8:13 am

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by LawrenceCooper » Fri Sep 08, 2017 8:32 am

Steven DuCharme wrote:I don't think ratings alone should be considered for any spots in the candidates. Players must play their way in.
Like me then you won't be a fan of the place for "An Organizer's Nominee. The player must be rated at least 2725 in any 2017 rating list."

NickFaulks
Posts: 6284
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:28 pm

Re: 2017 World Cup 2-27 September, Tbilisi

Post by NickFaulks » Fri Sep 08, 2017 9:56 am

LawrenceCooper wrote:Like me then you won't be a fan of the place for "An Organizer's Nominee. The player must be rated at least 2725 in any 2017 rating list."
That is a principled position, but the view of the players seems to be that if this persuades organisers to be more generous, so the other seven get much better terms than they otherwise would, they're happy to live with it.
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face — forever.

Post Reply