2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

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NickFaulks
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by NickFaulks » Thu Nov 16, 2017 12:02 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 12:44 am

That's something newly reported, that funding has been secured for three years.

Whose event is the Rapidplay and Blitz? Is it Agon or FIDE directly?
It is normal practice that such an agreement provides that, if all goes well, it will be repeated. I would agree that this might have been made explicit, although it is evidently not a well kept secret!

Agon had an option to hold this event for 2017, but presumably passed it up when they were unable to find a host. I think this vindicates what I have been saying for years, that FIDE could have done a better job themselves without using any of the series of chosen intermediaries. I hope this lesson is now taken to heart.
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Alex Holowczak
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by Alex Holowczak » Thu Nov 16, 2017 2:06 pm

Chris Rice wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 12:28 am
The ACP have been quick to come up with a statement on this
I think it's worth noting that that statement was posted on Facebook before this appeared on the FIDE website. It is interesting to speculate as to whether or not the ACP statement would have been different had they not got in before the FIDE statement.

Incidentally, the statement originally referred to a "historical" agreement, and as you might expect, my helpful contribution to the relevant Facebook post was not to be complimentary about what appear to be very positive things about the substance of the event, but to note wryly that they meant "historic". :oops: FIDE has now changed it though. :D
Chris Rice wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 12:28 am
It's interesting that the statement, if the ACP feel so strongly about it, stops short of urging their members to boycott the event or indeed says anything about the possibility of war breaking out between Saudi Arabia and Iran which might be detrimental to their members but perhaps I'm just being picky.
What sanction would they apply to their members? I think if push came to shove, and ACP members had to choose between having their membership revoked or not being eligible for ACP membership prizes, and playing in this event, they'd choose to play in the event. Not calling for a boycott presumably means the ACP Board think the same, and decided on balance that they'd rather have those players as members of their organisation than not.

NickFaulks
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by NickFaulks » Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:15 pm

Alex Holowczak wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 2:06 pm
I think it's worth noting that that statement was posted on Facebook before this appeared on the FIDE website. It is interesting to speculate as to whether or not the ACP statement would have been different had they not got in before the FIDE statement.
I imagine Sutovsky could have established the facts if he had been inclined to ask.
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Brian Towers
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by Brian Towers » Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:28 pm

Am I the only one who would love to see Sutovsky put his money where his mouth is / call MbS's bluff and submit an entry?

It would answer so many questions.

Would his Israeli passport based application be accepted? If accepted what happens when he turns up at Riyadh airport? Do they let him in? At the end of the tournament do they let him out? He is one of a tiny handful of people in a position to do this.
Ah, but I was so much older then. I'm younger than that now.

NickFaulks
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by NickFaulks » Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:35 pm

Brian Towers wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:28 pm
At the end of the tournament do they let him out?
Some people here have imaginations I can't keep up with.
Last edited by NickFaulks on Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Chris Rice
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by Chris Rice » Mon Nov 20, 2017 12:02 pm

If this article by Itamar Eichner the Diplomatic correspondent for the Israeli, Yedioth Ahronot newspaper, is to be believed then, following discussions with Kirsan Illyumzhinov, 11 applications from Israel chess players are due to be submitted for visas to play in Saudi Arabia. If approved it will be the first time in history that an Israeli team will have openly entered Saudi Arabia. Clearly, combined with allowing women to play without head covering or burkas, the Saudis are attempting to control the narrative and getting the media onside but this would indeed be significant progress if it comes to fruition. However, I would also expect some resistance to these steps from the religious hard liners within the country.

Brian Towers
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by Brian Towers » Mon Nov 20, 2017 2:52 pm

Very interesting article which also brings up the subject of the 2013 World youth championships held in Abu Dhabi where the Israeli players competed under the FIDE flag, allegedly for security reasons. If they do play this time will it be under the FIDE or Israeli flag? Will an Israeli flag be on display if not actually flying in Riyadh?
Ah, but I was so much older then. I'm younger than that now.

NickFaulks
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by NickFaulks » Mon Nov 20, 2017 3:42 pm

Chris Rice wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 12:02 pm
following discussions with Kirsan Illyumzhinov,
I had the impression this was sewn up well before any discussions last week.

edit : Having said that, this sort of diplomacy is exactly what Kirsan has always been good at. He may have been mollifying the Israeli federation, who are a fractious bunch.
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LawrenceCooper
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by LawrenceCooper » Mon Nov 20, 2017 4:02 pm

Brian Towers wrote:
Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:28 pm
Am I the only one who would love to see Sutovsky put his money where his mouth is / call MbS's bluff and submit an entry?

It would answer so many questions.

Would his Israeli passport based application be accepted? If accepted what happens when he turns up at Riyadh airport? Do they let him in? At the end of the tournament do they let him out? He is one of a tiny handful of people in a position to do this.
Emil Sutovsky (via Facebook)
1 hr ·
PLEASE, STOP POSTING AND REPOSTING FAKE NEWS.
At least about myself - I am not going to apply for visa to Saudi Arabia, and I am not going to play there. Resolutely and unequivocally. It is possible that some Israeli players will apply - but so far nobody did.

NickFaulks
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by NickFaulks » Mon Nov 20, 2017 4:31 pm

Are you in a position to tell us what fake news has been posted? Of course, Sutovsky lives in a glass house on that subject.
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LawrenceCooper
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by LawrenceCooper » Mon Nov 20, 2017 4:51 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 4:31 pm
Are you in a position to tell us what fake news has been posted? Of course, Sutovsky lives in a glass house on that subject.
According to his post it's to suggest he may apply for a visa to play in Saudi Arabia.

NickFaulks
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by NickFaulks » Mon Nov 20, 2017 5:21 pm

LawrenceCooper wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 4:51 pm
According to his post it's to suggest he may apply for a visa to play in Saudi Arabia.
Clearly so, but can you see who has made this outrageous suggestion?
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LawrenceCooper
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by LawrenceCooper » Mon Nov 20, 2017 5:39 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 5:21 pm
LawrenceCooper wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 4:51 pm
According to his post it's to suggest he may apply for a visa to play in Saudi Arabia.
Clearly so, but can you see who has made this outrageous suggestion?
I can't see any evidence of it at all but there is so much on his page, mostly requiring a translation, that it's becoming harder than ever to make any sense of what he posts.

NickFaulks
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by NickFaulks » Mon Nov 20, 2017 6:04 pm

LawrenceCooper wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 5:39 pm
I can't see any evidence of it at all but there is so much on his page, mostly requiring a translation, that it's becoming harder than ever to make any sense of what he posts.
Thanks, I'm not wise in the ways of Facebook and I wondered if it was just me.
Last edited by NickFaulks on Mon Nov 20, 2017 8:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Alex Holowczak
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

Post by Alex Holowczak » Mon Nov 20, 2017 7:10 pm

Chris Rice wrote:
Mon Nov 20, 2017 12:02 pm
If this article by Itamar Eichner the Diplomatic correspondent for the Israeli, Yedioth Ahronot newspaper, is to be believed then, following discussions with Kirsan Illyumzhinov, 11 applications from Israel chess players are due to be submitted for visas to play in Saudi Arabia. If approved it will be the first time in history that an Israeli team will have openly entered Saudi Arabia. Clearly, combined with allowing women to play without head covering or burkas, the Saudis are attempting to control the narrative and getting the media onside but this would indeed be significant progress if it comes to fruition. However, I would also expect some resistance to these steps from the religious hard liners within the country.
It seems logical to me that the Israelis should apply for visas, if only to call FIDE's bluff if they get rejected. If the visa application succeeds, there's still no obligation for them to actually go to Saudi Arabia if they don't want to. So what do they have to lose?