2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017

[Brian Towers]

Oh! It didn't seem a leap to me. Have I misunderstood Nick? If so I certainly apologise.

I think what Nick is saying is very obvious. Objects have primary uses. If you sell somebody an object expect them to use it in the normal way.

You sell people chess sets, expect them to play chess.
Sell them food, expect them to eat it.
Sell them bombs, expect them to drop them on other people.

The implication being that if you don't want them dropping bombs then don't sell them bombs.

[NickFaulks]

The implication being that if you don't want them dropping bombs then don't sell them bombs.

And if you do sell them and they do use them, don't try to regain the moral high ground by boycotting their chess events.

[Michael Farthing]

Sorry Nick, I clearly totally miinterpreted.

[Stewart Reuben]

The FIDE Statute is, or aat least was, that if two countries were at war with each other, then the one country did n ot have to facilitate entry for players from the other.
However, several countries have said they are at war with israel, but Israel does not recognise that they are at wr with them.

It has long been an unwritten rule that players from certain countries are never paired with Israelis. This was ignored in the first round of the Olympiad in 2008 and Israel was paired with the Yemen in round 1. That resulted in Israel winning 4-0 by default.
One year in Gibraltar, before the first round pairings, I went and spoke to the players from Qatar and the UAE and asked them their position. The Qatari were happy to play if so paired, the Emirates not. There was no problem.

[NickFaulks]

"1.2.

.....

FIDE events (competitions, congresses, meetings) may be hosted only by Federations where free access is generally assured to representatives of all Federations.
The General Assembly may take exceptions for reasons of state of war or severe violence between countries, only on a three quarter majority vote."

I do not know whether such a three quarter majority vote has ever happened.

[Stewart Reuben]

Nick >I do not know whether such a three quarter majority vote has ever happened.<

I don't know whether such a vote has ever taken place.
In 1984 the UAE were awarded the Olympiad for Dubai 1986. It was made clear Israel would not be invited. There was a vote in the GA, as is standard for hosting the Olympiad. In a way it was fair, the Olympiad had been held in Israel. That meant several Arabic countries boycotted the event.
Had Jonathan Mestel not given his blessing to the English team for Dubai, it is very likely we would have boycotted the event as then Jon Speelman wouldn't have gone either.

[Jonathan Rogers]

Nick >I do not know whether such a three quarter majority vote has ever happened.<

I don't know whether such a vote has ever taken place.
In 1984 the UAE were awarded the Olympiad for Dubai 1986. It was made clear Israel would not be invited. There was a vote in the GA, as is standard for hosting the Olympiad. In a way it was fair, the Olympiad had been held in Israel. That meant several Arabic countries boycotted the event.
Had Jonathan Mestel not given his blessing to the English team for Dubai, it is very likely we would have boycotted the event as then Jon Speelman wouldn't have gone either.

In exactly what way did that make it fair, assuming that they boycotted the event as opposed to not being invited?

And in exactly what what way did Mestel "give his blessing" to the English team in 1986? What did he actually say?

[Stewart Reuben]

Jonathan R >In exactly what way did that make it fair, assuming that they boycotted the event as opposed to not being invited?
And in exactly what what way did Mestel "give his blessing" to the English team in 1986? What did he actually say?<

Because the GA voted for Israel for the Olympiad in the certain knowledge that some federations would boycott the event. In those days it was often difficult to find a country wiling to host this expensive event.
I have no idea what Jonathan M actually said. It was hearsay from my viewpoint and 31 years ago!

[NickFaulks]

In a way it was fair, the Olympiad had been held in Israel.

The Arab nations would all have been welcome to attend that one, so it wasn't fair at all. Boycotting a sporting event for non-sporting reasons should be frowned upon, not rewarded.

[Stewart Reuben]

That is ingenuous. Many of the Arabic participants would then have been persona non grata in their own country. It would have been very dangerous to have returned home.

[Brian Towers]

That is ingenuous. Many of the Arabic participants would then have been persona non grata in their own country. It would have been very dangerous to have returned home.

Nonsense, Stewart, those players wouldn't have been allowed to leave home in the first place. You are making false comparisons.

[Stewart Reuben]

Brian >those players wouldn't have been allowed to leave home in the first place. You are making false comparisons.<

How come then I met players at such events as the Lloyds Bank Masters where they assured me it was impossible for them to play against Israeli opponents?
How come the Yemen defaulted 4-0 against Israel in 2008?

[Jonathan Rogers]

It would be tough on the players, all right. No doubt in practice they would not feel able to play in Israel.

But not because of anything the Israelis have done or decided to that end.

And that is where your analogy falls down, with the barring of Israeli players by host Arab countries.

[Stewart Reuben]

Arab countries think the Israelis have done wrong - by existing. I don't agree, but the fact is they still think like that. And they remain members of FIDE which has the motto, 'Gens Una Sumus'.

[Jonathan Rogers]

Stewart, I can barely believe I am reading this! The fact that some Arab countries think like that (if they do) is neither here nor there. The right of sovereign nations to exist has to be a non-negotiable starting point!!

I can only hope that I have misunderstood you. Are you really saying that there is some equivalence between the examples above, one which the rest of the world should recognise?