Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

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Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election?

Poll ended at Mon Oct 01, 2018 8:05 am

Arkady Dvorkovich
5
11%
Georgios Makropoulos
9
20%
Nigel Short
22
48%
None of the Above
10
22%
 
Total votes: 46

Chris Rice
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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by Chris Rice » Wed Jul 25, 2018 3:19 pm

Zurab Azmaiprashvili, the ECU President speaks. Very interesting things he has to say. If you remember Dvorkovich turned up at a Presidential Board meeting and got invited in which upset Nigel. Apparently the real reason Dvorkovich was there was to offer Makropoulos a job as long as he withdrew from the election.
"There is nothing to hide: Georgios Makropoulos and Arkady Dvorkovich have talked face to face in Bucharest. Their meeting started late at night and lasted for a few hours until dawn. I can confirm that Dvorkovich offered Makropoulos to join his team and be the second in rank, if Georgios gave up taking part in the elections. However, it should be said in favor of the FIDE Deputy President, that he had declined all such offers. Despite all this, I think that Dvorkovich will try once again to persuade his competitor, however, it could be said today that "the first round of negotiations" has ended with his defeat."

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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by David Robertson » Wed Jul 25, 2018 3:46 pm

Zurab Azmaiprashvili wrote:Their meeting started late at night and lasted for a few hours until dawn
...by which time they were too tired and emotional to continue

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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by Mick Norris » Wed Jul 25, 2018 4:50 pm

Chris Rice wrote:
Wed Jul 25, 2018 3:19 pm
Zurab Azmaiprashvili, the ECU President speaks. Very interesting things he has to say.
Of which this seems a bit of a threat (unless the meaning was lost in translation)
And finally, because the elections are held in Georgia (Batumi), as a Georgian, I must say - Dvorkovich cannot escape the fact that his country and Kremlin had captured my homeland, Georgia's ancient corner, Samachablo and Kodori Valley exactly 10 years ago. Georgia remembers a lot of unacceptable things from Russia, but the 2008 war and such an open aggression has never been there before. Exactly in that period, during the August war days, Dvorkovich was assisting Russia's President. Although it was in economic and financial issues, but still... In the recent past, he was the Deputy Prime Minister of the country that has occupied 20% of my country…

Such a high-ranking person should acknowledge and take into account that the Georgian people cannot be positive towards his persona. Before his arrival in Batumi for the FIDE presidential elections, I advise him to understand the situation and carefully find the messages that will at least slightly change the attitude of the Georgian people towards him.
Any postings on here represent my personal views and should not be taken as representative of the Manchester Chess Federation www.manchesterchess.co.uk

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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by Chris Rice » Thu Jul 26, 2018 10:43 am

Chess Drum report on the controversy of financial arrears and voting rights which are clearly not going to go away anytime soon.

Nigel actually doubling down "With great hypocrisy, the @makro_chess administration - purveyors of fake news par excellence - ask @advorkovich to stop spreading "fake news" http://www.fide.com/component/content/a ... -news.html …. Financial arrears have been routinely used as a means of extorting votes from federations #cleanhands4fide"

and here "There are few greater insults to democracy than the spectacle of delegates sitting impotently in the FIDE General Assembly while their proxies are cast by others - often with no connection to their federation. Stop the selling of votes. Abolish proxies now! #cleanhands4fide"

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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by NickFaulks » Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:20 pm

Chris Rice wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 10:43 am
Chess Drum report on the controversy of financial arrears and voting rights which are clearly not going to go away anytime soon.
Nor will it, for so long as politicians and journalists continue to conflate two issues.

1. Voting rights, which are not impaired by arrears, until such time as they cause the federation to be expelled.

2. The right to enter teams in FIDE events, which is quite reasonably withheld from federations which are in serious arrear with their dues. In practice, everybody wants to see as many teams as possible at Olympiads ( well, Tromso didn't because they couldn't cope but that's another story ) and these problems are made to disappear.

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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by Chris Rice » Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:43 pm

Chris Rice wrote:
Wed Jul 25, 2018 3:19 pm
Zurab Azmaiprashvili, the ECU President speaks. Very interesting things he has to say. If you remember Dvorkovich turned up at a Presidential Board meeting and got invited in which upset Nigel. Apparently the real reason Dvorkovich was there was to offer Makropoulos a job as long as he withdrew from the election.
"There is nothing to hide: Georgios Makropoulos and Arkady Dvorkovich have talked face to face in Bucharest. Their meeting started late at night and lasted for a few hours until dawn. I can confirm that Dvorkovich offered Makropoulos to join his team and be the second in rank, if Georgios gave up taking part in the elections. However, it should be said in favor of the FIDE Deputy President, that he had declined all such offers. Despite all this, I think that Dvorkovich will try once again to persuade his competitor, however, it could be said today that "the first round of negotiations" has ended with his defeat."
Now denied by Dvorkovich:

"Greetings from South Africa! Have been surprised by claims that I offered @makro_chess to become my deputy at FIDE if elected. Never did that! He has been a grey cardinal for too long. My vision of FIDE future is totally different, so no plans to offer him any executive position."

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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by Alex Holowczak » Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:02 pm

Chris Rice wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:43 pm
Chris Rice wrote:
Wed Jul 25, 2018 3:19 pm
Zurab Azmaiprashvili, the ECU President speaks. Very interesting things he has to say. If you remember Dvorkovich turned up at a Presidential Board meeting and got invited in which upset Nigel. Apparently the real reason Dvorkovich was there was to offer Makropoulos a job as long as he withdrew from the election.
"There is nothing to hide: Georgios Makropoulos and Arkady Dvorkovich have talked face to face in Bucharest. Their meeting started late at night and lasted for a few hours until dawn. I can confirm that Dvorkovich offered Makropoulos to join his team and be the second in rank, if Georgios gave up taking part in the elections. However, it should be said in favor of the FIDE Deputy President, that he had declined all such offers. Despite all this, I think that Dvorkovich will try once again to persuade his competitor, however, it could be said today that "the first round of negotiations" has ended with his defeat."
Now denied by Dvorkovich:

"Greetings from South Africa! Have been surprised by claims that I offered @makro_chess to become my deputy at FIDE if elected. Never did that! He has been a grey cardinal for too long. My vision of FIDE future is totally different, so no plans to offer him any executive position."
That's interesting, because "grey cardinal" is presumably a Russian phrase translated into English, despite the French "eminence grise" being more commonly used in spoken English.

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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by David Robertson » Fri Jul 27, 2018 12:31 pm

Alex Holowczak wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:02 pm
That's interesting, because "grey cardinal" is presumably a Russian phrase translated into English, despite the French "eminence grise" being more commonly used in spoken English
Translated by a machine probably. I'm near to finishing the reading of an excellent book on translation from which the following example is taken.

The well-known English saying: The spirit is willing, but the flesh is weak can emerge in Russian, from Google-translate and similar, as The vodka is strong, but the meat is rotten :) (which is what Makropoulos may have said to Dvorkovich)

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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by JustinHorton » Fri Jul 27, 2018 1:36 pm

Dvorkovich gives a relatively illuminating interview to chess.com in which he bigs up his plans for women's chess, then fails to know the name of the women's world champion and compounds his error by saying (in not so many words) that all these Chinese names look the same to him.
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

lostontime.blogspot.com

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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by Brian Towers » Fri Jul 27, 2018 2:46 pm

David Robertson wrote:
Fri Jul 27, 2018 12:31 pm
Alex Holowczak wrote:
Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:02 pm
That's interesting, because "grey cardinal" is presumably a Russian phrase translated into English, despite the French "eminence grise" being more commonly used in spoken English
Translated by a machine probably.
No.
Try typing "grey cardinal Vladislav Surkov" and you get dozens of hits including from Wikipedia, The Independent, the FT, Reuters, etc., etc.
For just "grey cardinal Russia" you get an interesting hit from the Irish Independent for an article dating from August 1999 which starts -
VLADIMIR Putin is a loyal but little-known figure nicknamed the Grey Cardinal.Putin (47), married with two children, graduated from the law faculty of Leningrad University before being recruited into the KGB's foreign espionage operation. He was posted to Dresden, then part of East Germany, for 15 years.
Given the power these officials have the phrase originally assigned to Cardinal Richlieu, "Éminence rouge", would seem more appropriate.
The original éminence grise was François Leclerc du Tremblay, Richlieu's second in command who, lacking an official title / de jure power, exerted his de facto power via influence over his boss. All these people have official titles which grant them de jure power.
Ah, but I was so much older then. I'm younger than that now.

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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by Stewart Reuben » Mon Aug 06, 2018 12:44 pm

ACP Board has thoroughly discussed the forthcoming FIDE Presidential elections and unanimously voted to support the candidacy of Arkady Dvorkovich.

It is the first time ever ACP takes a stand and supports any candidate in any elections. This does not come lightheartedly: to the contrary, it is a consequence of the ever deteriorating situation in the chess world caused by the malfunctioning of the present FIDE leadership. We have repeatedly expressed our disagreement with many decisions taken by FIDE and we firmly believe it is time for drastic change.

We do not believe that the people who managed FIDE for over thirty years will be able to change their approach and policies if they are re-elected. In fact, judging by their attitude and official platform, they don’t even plan to change. We need a new team with a different vision.

The program of Mr.Dvorkovich includes many important points that ACP advocated throughout the years and we believe it can bring a major change. He possesses skills and experience and he played a key role in organizing a whole range of top chess events. We believe he is able to lead FIDE and the chess world to the heights our game deserves.

We also share many points aired by another candidate, GM Nigel Short, and we think he could be an important member of the new team. However, his very limited managing experience and different set of skills lead us to believe he would be better suited as a valuable contributor rather than a leader.

ACP Board finds the forthcoming 2018 elections to be critical for the fate of the entire chess world and we call upon the federations to make a wise choice.

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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Mon Aug 06, 2018 12:53 pm

Is that a quote from Association of Chess Professionals (ACP) President Emil Sutovsky on Facebook? I can't find it on the internet anywhere (you likely have to be logged in to Facebook to see that post). How likely is it that national chess federations will listen to the ACP? Is it not more likely that individual grandmasters (GMs) will in some cases be able to discuss or influence a vote directly (if they are politically active in chess administration in their country), but in most cases will have very little political influence?

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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by LawrenceCooper » Mon Aug 06, 2018 1:16 pm

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:
Mon Aug 06, 2018 12:53 pm
Is that a quote from Association of Chess Professionals (ACP) President Emil Sutovsky on Facebook? I can't find it on the internet anywhere (you likely have to be logged in to Facebook to see that post). How likely is it that national chess federations will listen to the ACP? Is it not more likely that individual grandmasters (GMs) will in some cases be able to discuss or influence a vote directly (if they are politically active in chess administration in their country), but in most cases will have very little political influence?
https://www.chessprofessionals.org/cont ... dvorkovich

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Mon Aug 06, 2018 1:38 pm

Thank you. Should have been able to find that. :oops:

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Re: Which Candidate Should the ECF Support in the FIDE Presidential Election? (Take 2)

Post by Stewart Reuben » Mon Aug 06, 2018 1:43 pm

When was the last time an incumbent President of FIDE did NOT offer himself as a candidate for re-election? Possibly Max Euwe.
There may be a mess, starting with who will chair the meeting.
Some federations won't have made up their minds yet. GMs could have a valuable role there, but many of the more independent federations don't have GMs. But not all ACP members are GMs.

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