Problem Integrity

Questions and Support regarding the Certificate of Merit.
Roger de Coverly
Posts: 16820
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 2:51 pm

Re: Problem Integrity

Post by Roger de Coverly » Mon Oct 17, 2011 9:07 am

Christopher Kreuzer wrote: It's interesting. Both rooks control d7 and g4 in the sense that they 'prevent' the other rook moving there, but they can't move there themselves without putting themselves en prise. I agree the question needs rephrasing, but sympathise with John given his description of the process of producing these questions.
If it's Black to move, the salient features of the position are that Black cannot move to g4 or d7 because the White rook controls these squares. If it's White to move, the salient features are that White, should he wish to move the Rook needs to analyse putting it on g4 or d7 carefully as it appears to be en prise.

User avatar
Nik Puryer
Posts: 13
Joined: Sun Oct 16, 2011 10:14 am
Location: Rushden, Northants.
Contact:

Re: Problem Integrity

Post by Nik Puryer » Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:17 am

Lo again, and thanks for all the replies. Yes John I refer to the practice test you identified, Q's 16 & 17, and have given full explanations of my queries in emails. Please advise if you wish me to resend. Regarding the problem discussed (Q17) my objection regards the use of the word 'control' in the question whereas the answer is concerned with 'movement'. I'd say that in the mind of a chess player viewing the problem that these are 2 distinct things (or should be). If the question is one of movement then of course 14 is correct, but if it is one of control then it depends on who is to move ... .. . as with white to play then the black rook 'controls' 2 of the white rook's target squares and would capture it should it land on g4 or d7. As has been said, all of this could be resolved by clarifying the question to one of movement, or perhaps have 2 problems the same, one referring to movement and one referring to control (stating who is to move) with the correct answers being 14 & 12 respectively. I continue sadly to claim that I answered the 'question' correctly and am exceedingly depressed with my alleged 19/20.

If someone could place a diagram of Q16 from this test it would help greatly. The question states:

Question : What is wrong with the way the pieces are set up on this board? (Note: asking about 'pieces')

Well, black's K+Q are the wrong way round, so are white's, AND the board is the wrong way round. 3 wrongs.

Possible answers :
1. Black's Knights and Bishops are the wrong way round WRONG
2. White's King and Queen are the wrong way round RIGHT
3. Black's King and Queen are the wrong way round RIGHT
4. The board is the wrong way round! RIGHT
5. White's Knights and Bishops are the wrong way round WRONG

Your answer is correct!
Explanation : The bottom right hand square should always be a light or White square.

So, 3 items incorrect on the board, 3 possible correct answers, but whereas the question specifically directs the testee to think of pieces the 'correct' given answer is the .. . erm .. . board. Oops.

Hope this helps, and thanks once again for all the great work you do, cheers.
ps I happily accept not having absorbed any DVD's or training booklets informing me of an improved 'chess perception' of the word 'control', so perhaps I'm just misunderstanding the intention behind its use.

John Upham
Posts: 4093
Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 10:29 am
Location: Cove, Hampshire, England.
Contact:

Re: Problem Integrity

Post by John Upham » Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:33 am

Hi Nik,

Here is the image for 16th question (#14 in the db) as requested. It was a little challenging to create this image within ChessBase.

A small prize of a "I am a termite - get over it!" Tee shirt is on offer for a correct solution as to how I created this image in ChessBase!
Attachments
14_small.jpg
CoM question image for question 14
14_small.jpg (24.91 KiB) Viewed 2782 times
Last edited by John Upham on Mon Oct 17, 2011 12:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Jon D'Souza-Eva

Re: Problem Integrity

Post by Jon D'Souza-Eva » Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:48 am

I'd imagine you just changed the display colour of the black squares to something light and that of the light squares to something dark, and then did the same for the colours of the pieces.

John Upham
Posts: 4093
Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 10:29 am
Location: Cove, Hampshire, England.
Contact:

Re: Problem Integrity

Post by John Upham » Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:57 am

Jon D'Souza-Eva wrote:I'd imagine you just changed the display colour of the black squares to something light and that of the light squares to something dark, and then did the same for the colours of the pieces.

Where are the options to do this in ChessBase? Good attempt by the way!

User avatar
Gavin Strachan
Posts: 676
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2007 10:06 am
Contact:

Re: Problem Integrity

Post by Gavin Strachan » Mon Oct 17, 2011 12:05 pm

I have just done the test and got one wrong though I think the wording is a bit unclear.

Question : What is the maximum number of squares a Rook may move to in a single move?

Rook is on A1 kings in the middle. Choices are:

Possible answers :


1. Sixteen (16)
2. Fifteen (15)
3. Eight (8)
4. Seven (7)
5. Fourteen (14)

Correct is : Fourteen (14)

Explanation : Provided there are no pieces in its path then a Rook may always move to seven other squares along the same rank and seven other squares along the same file. We do not include the square that the Rook occupies.

I put 7 as legally it could go from a1-a8, or a1-h1 which is 7 squares in a single move each. Although the rook can move from a1-a8 or a1-h1, it cannot legally do that in a single move. I think the question should be how many squares does the rook attack? or change the answer.

John Upham
Posts: 4093
Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 10:29 am
Location: Cove, Hampshire, England.
Contact:

Re: Problem Integrity

Post by John Upham » Mon Oct 17, 2011 12:23 pm

Gavin,

You have just completed test #1852 and scored 19/20 so many congratulations are due!

The 4th question you answered was question #2 and the diagram below is the one used and the question text is:
What is the maximum number of squares a Rook may move to in a single move?
In hindsight, the answer could be 1, 7 or 14 depending on your viewpoint.

Perhaps the text should be
What is the maximum number of different squares a Rook may move to in a single move?
or
How many squares (of any colour, other than a1) may the black rook (or castle) move to in a single half-ply move in the diagrammed position below assuming black has the move and the game result hasn't already been agreed or decided? Assume that the normal FIDE rules of chess apply and that we are not using variant rules and it is not cylindrical chess or we are not using a 10x10 board with the outer squares not shown.
Let us leave no room for doubt!
Attachments
2_small.jpg
CoM question image for question # 2.
2_small.jpg (17.16 KiB) Viewed 2703 times

User avatar
David Shepherd
Posts: 801
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2007 3:46 pm

Re: Problem Integrity

Post by David Shepherd » Mon Oct 17, 2011 12:42 pm

Is there a procedure in place for monitoring which questions get the most incorrect answers and then checking the questions? Also for reporting possible errors in questions?

John Upham
Posts: 4093
Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 10:29 am
Location: Cove, Hampshire, England.
Contact:

Re: Problem Integrity

Post by John Upham » Mon Oct 17, 2011 12:52 pm

David,

Stewart and I respond to feedback by making changes to diagrams, question text and answer text as and when it has been agreed to make changes.

There is a backlog of updates for the FIDE Arbiters test, mostly of a semantic nature and the ball is in my court to deal with them. Alex, Alex and others have been most helpful in fine tuning things behind the scenes so thanks to them!

We do monitor which questions are answered most or least accurately. The conclusion we have arrived at is that the questions answered least accurately are the most taxing / challenging ones.

Perhaps all questions should be equally trivial or challenging? That would be non-trivial to arrange.

User avatar
David Shepherd
Posts: 801
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2007 3:46 pm

Re: Problem Integrity

Post by David Shepherd » Mon Oct 17, 2011 1:25 pm

Ok thanks - I think that is the most important thing i.e. that there is a procedure in place for reporting and improving - over time any unclear/incorrect questions should be eliminated.

Alex Holowczak
Posts: 8287
Joined: Sat May 30, 2009 5:18 pm
Location: Oldbury, Worcestershire
Contact:

Re: Problem Integrity

Post by Alex Holowczak » Mon Oct 17, 2011 7:22 pm

John Upham wrote:
Jon D'Souza-Eva wrote:I'd imagine you just changed the display colour of the black squares to something light and that of the light squares to something dark, and then did the same for the colours of the pieces.

Where are the options to do this in ChessBase? Good attempt by the way!
The clue is the way the Knights are facing!

You've flipped the image, basically. It's just the normal starting position of a game of chess.

John Upham
Posts: 4093
Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 10:29 am
Location: Cove, Hampshire, England.
Contact:

Re: Problem Integrity

Post by John Upham » Mon Oct 17, 2011 7:35 pm

Alex Holowczak wrote:
John Upham wrote:
Jon D'Souza-Eva wrote:I'd imagine you just changed the display colour of the black squares to something light and that of the light squares to something dark, and then did the same for the colours of the pieces.

Where are the options to do this in ChessBase? Good attempt by the way!
The clue is the way the Knights are facing!

You've flipped the image, basically. It's just the normal starting position of a game of chess.
Alex,

Congratulations! You have won tonight's star prize which is either

1. a night out with guess who to discuss the pros and cons of MO options versus Chess Tax OR
2. a night out (sporting a "I am a Termite and proud of it tee shirt") with guess who to discuss the meaning of egregious in a fora context OR (much worse)
3. 1. & 2. serially.

Let me know your choice and I will arrange to be a chaperone together with a famous chess correspondent. :lol:

Locked