County Championships - time for a change?

Discussion about all aspects of the ECF County Championships.
John Swain
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County Championships - time for a change?

Post by John Swain » Sat Apr 27, 2013 10:03 pm

I have been playing competitive chess of one sort or another for over forty years, but I don't think I've ever played in a match before where some players (not all!) on both teams spoke about not being too worried if they lost (as a team) and wondered how they would manage if they won.

This was the situation in today's U180 match at Milton Keynes between Nottinghamshire and Essex. Notts have their U160 team already through to the Quarter-Finals but many in today's team were graded under 160; Essex are heavily committed with their Open and U160 teams through to the same stage scheduled for 18 May.

You would not have guessed, though, because the match was played in a very good, competitive spirit, with the match being decided only on boardcount.

Surely the obvious solution would have been for the ECF to stagger the Quarter-Finals, with the Open, U160 teams etc. playing one weekend, and the U180, U140 etc. playing the next? This kind of possibility seems to have been set up for the Semi-Finals.

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: County Championships

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Sat Apr 27, 2013 10:23 pm

Er, who won!? :?

John Swain
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Re: County Championships

Post by John Swain » Sat Apr 27, 2013 10:29 pm

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:Er, who won!? :?
Notts

Alex Holowczak
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Re: County Championships

Post by Alex Holowczak » Sat Apr 27, 2013 11:13 pm

John Swain wrote:
Christopher Kreuzer wrote:Er, who won!? :?
Notts
You can see all this online already. http://www.englishchess.org.uk/county-c ... -20122013/

Alex Holowczak
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Re: County Championships

Post by Alex Holowczak » Sat Apr 27, 2013 11:15 pm

John Swain wrote:This kind of possibility seems to have been set up for the Semi-Finals.
Has it? This is the first the Controller has heard about it if it has.

John Swain
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Re: County Championships

Post by John Swain » Sat Apr 27, 2013 11:30 pm

Alex Holowczak wrote:
John Swain wrote:
Christopher Kreuzer wrote:Er, who won!? :?
Notts
You can see all this online already. http://www.englishchess.org.uk/county-c ... -20122013/
Thanks for publishing the results so quickly, Alex - very efficient!

John Swain
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Re: County Championships

Post by John Swain » Sat Apr 27, 2013 11:36 pm

Alex Holowczak wrote:
John Swain wrote:This kind of possibility seems to have been set up for the Semi-Finals.
Has it? This is the first the Controller has heard about it if it has.
Apologies if I have misread/misunderstood the statement on the ECF website which seems to allow the Semi-Finals on a choice of two consecutive weekends, but only with the agreement of both captains, the 8 June being the default option. You can only play on staggered weekends if the opposing captain agrees (and why should he?)

Neil Graham
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Re: County Championships

Post by Neil Graham » Sun Apr 28, 2013 12:05 am

John Swain wrote:
Thanks for publishing the results so quickly, Alex - very efficient!
Sorry John you have to thank me and the Essex captain. There is now an on-line system (courtesy of Alex) where we spend all evening filling in the details that now appear on the website.

John Swain
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Re: County Championships

Post by John Swain » Sun Apr 28, 2013 12:09 am

Neil Graham wrote:
John Swain wrote:
Thanks for publishing the results so quickly, Alex - very efficient!
Sorry John you have to thank me and the Essex captain. There is now an on-line system (courtesy of Alex) where we spend all evening filling in the details that now appear on the website.
I stand corrected! Many thanks to you both - hard work at the end of a long day.

Richard Bates
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Re: County Championships

Post by Richard Bates » Sun Apr 28, 2013 5:55 am

There's not much point in Counties seeking to stagger their quarter/semi finals unless they think that a problem with player recruitment is temporary and that they will have full commitment for the Final.

John Swain
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Re: County Championships

Post by John Swain » Sun Apr 28, 2013 9:13 am

Richard Bates wrote:There's not much point in Counties seeking to stagger their quarter/semi finals unless they think that a problem with player recruitment is temporary and that they will have full commitment for the Final.
A fair point, but by the time of the Final a lot of the affected teams would have been defeated and very few counties left with "adjacent" teams. The present arrangement gives an even bigger advantage to larger counties.

Richard Bates
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Re: County Championships

Post by Richard Bates » Sun Apr 28, 2013 9:54 am

John Swain wrote:
Richard Bates wrote:There's not much point in Counties seeking to stagger their quarter/semi finals unless they think that a problem with player recruitment is temporary and that they will have full commitment for the Final.
A fair point, but by the time of the Final a lot of the affected teams would have been defeated and very few counties left with "adjacent" teams. The present arrangement gives an even bigger advantage to larger counties.
In theory yes, but don't forget the larger counties will be the ones most likely to try and enter teams in all the competitions (and endure the compromises that involves). Smaller counties will realise their limits and target their resources accordingly. Which can help balance things up in the lower competitions.

Sean Hewitt
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Re: County Championships

Post by Sean Hewitt » Tue Jun 04, 2013 12:47 pm

ECF Website wrote:From http://www.englishchess.org.uk/county-c ... r-required
At the moment, there is no Controller for the Final Stage of the County Championship. In the absence of a Controller, I have covered the work this year, but I do not intend to do this next year.

The Final Stage will not run in the 2013/14 season unless a Controller is appointed. Click here for the responsibilities of the County Championship Controller. Volunteers who are interested should contact me via the e-mail address below.

Alex Holowczak, Director of Home Chess Email: director.homechess@englishchess.org.uk

David Gostelow
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Re: County Championships

Post by David Gostelow » Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:49 pm

Richard Bates wrote:
John Swain wrote:
Richard Bates wrote:There's not much point in Counties seeking to stagger their quarter/semi finals unless they think that a problem with player recruitment is temporary and that they will have full commitment for the Final.
A fair point, but by the time of the Final a lot of the affected teams would have been defeated and very few counties left with "adjacent" teams. The present arrangement gives an even bigger advantage to larger counties.
In theory yes, but don't forget the larger counties will be the ones most likely to try and enter teams in all the competitions (and endure the compromises that involves). Smaller counties will realise their limits and target their resources accordingly. Which can help balance things up in the lower competitions.
Shropshire no longer runs a first team only u140 which is a shame , so over 140 players cant play county chess. When I moved to Shropshire in 85 , most top county players played in all county matchs and though we lossed most, it was something you looked forward too . The Greater Manchester situation was always awkward as doing a round trip of between 180 and 250 miles to get slaughtered was not appealing and thus we had problems with the away years to G Manchester

Mick Norris
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Re: County Championships

Post by Mick Norris » Tue Jun 04, 2013 1:57 pm

David Gostelow wrote:Shropshire no longer runs a first team only u140 which is a shame , so over 140 players cant play county chess. When I moved to Shropshire in 85 , most top county players played in all county matchs and though we lossed most, it was something you looked forward too . The Greater Manchester situation was always awkward as doing a round trip of between 180 and 250 miles to get slaughtered was not appealing and thus we had problems with the away years to G Manchester
Under current MCCU rules, you can insist on playing G Man at a neutral venue each year rather than alternate home and away

From our perspective, we always found many opposition captains to be resistant to this before we got the Rule introduced
Any postings on here represent my personal views and should not be taken as representative of the Manchester Chess Federation www.manchesterchess.co.uk

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