Brexit tea leaves

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John Upham
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Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by John Upham » Tue Dec 17, 2019 4:18 pm

John McKenna wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 1:05 pm
When Ted Heath's gov. took us into the European Community. (Without so much as a by your leave.)
Ted Heath did no such thing.

It was John Major on November 1st 1993 who signed the Maastricht Treaty on behalf of the United Kingdom.
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John McKenna

Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by John McKenna » Tue Dec 17, 2019 4:21 pm

Chris, Nick means the writing is on the wall no matter what. We are sailing away, just a question of how far (and that's a mutually agreed distance.)

Nick, a good few have already used or are queuing to use the Irish escape hatch. Good luck to 'em.

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Tue Dec 17, 2019 4:24 pm

My suspicion is that the rest of the EU will play hardball. They won't mind taking a hit from a no-deal Brexit if it means that the rest of the EU stays together and united. The ideals of the EU project has always meant more than short-term economic pain. It is Ireland that will really suffer if the gamble from Boris does not pay off.

John McKenna

Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by John McKenna » Tue Dec 17, 2019 4:51 pm

I suspect the Irish will be compensated and that the EU will only succeed in driving the UK further away, into the Anglosphere, if they push too hard.

NickFaulks
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Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by NickFaulks » Tue Dec 17, 2019 4:59 pm

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 4:24 pm
It is Ireland that will really suffer if the gamble from Boris does not pay off.
We are in agreement, and I don't have a problem with that. Things will get messy for Varadkar when the Irish people notice they have been stitched up. They are not noted for their forgiveness.
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John McKenna

Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by John McKenna » Tue Dec 17, 2019 5:20 pm

Then I suppose the two of you could think the solution is for Ireland to leave the EU and join the New British Empire!?

NickFaulks
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Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by NickFaulks » Tue Dec 17, 2019 11:07 pm

The MP for Holborn & St Pancras is now the bookies' favourite to be the next Labour leader. Seriously, isn't that how they got here? But who else is there?
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John Clarke
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Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by John Clarke » Tue Dec 17, 2019 11:11 pm

John McKenna wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 4:21 pm
We are sailing away, just a question of how far (and that's a mutually agreed distance.)
.... and there's going to be a lot more sea to sail on (not to mention rather less of the British Isles) once Greenland and Antarctica have shed most of their ice. That problem is of far more importance to my mind than any aspect of the UK's survival as a political entity, or its relationship with Europe or the USA. But is it going to be addressed in the next five years?
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Jonathan Rogers
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Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by Jonathan Rogers » Wed Dec 18, 2019 4:13 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 11:07 pm
The MP for Holborn & St Pancras is now the bookies' favourite to be the next Labour leader. Seriously, isn't that how they got here?
Not obviously, no
NickFaulks wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 11:07 pm

But who else is there?
You've got me there.

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Christopher Kreuzer
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Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by Christopher Kreuzer » Wed Dec 18, 2019 5:02 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
Tue Dec 17, 2019 11:07 pm
The MP for Holborn & St Pancras is now the bookies' favourite to be the next Labour leader. Seriously, isn't that how they got here? But who else is there?
Why not name him? Keir Starmer.

The news reports I am reading make the joint ticket of Angela Rayner and Rebecca Long-Bailey the favourite.

Though the first to officially declare is Emily Thornberry (though given what you said about Starmer, I guess you feel the same way about her).

NickFaulks
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Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by NickFaulks » Wed Dec 18, 2019 6:00 pm

Christopher Kreuzer wrote:
Wed Dec 18, 2019 5:02 pm
Why not name him? Keir Starmer.
Because my point was that he is another London left wing intellectual, which hasn't worked too well for them lately.
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Matt Mackenzie
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Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by Matt Mackenzie » Wed Dec 18, 2019 6:36 pm

Bookies odds on political matters are rarely infallible, and will likely be especially unreliable at this early a stage of the contest.
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Jonathan Rogers
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Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by Jonathan Rogers » Wed Dec 18, 2019 7:26 pm

NickFaulks wrote:
Wed Dec 18, 2019 6:00 pm
Christopher Kreuzer wrote:
Wed Dec 18, 2019 5:02 pm
Why not name him? Keir Starmer.
Because my point was that he is another London left wing intellectual, which hasn't worked too well for them lately.
He would, however, look credible which might distinguish him from the previous two.

Incidentally in what sense was Corbyn an "intellectual"?

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Matt Mackenzie
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Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by Matt Mackenzie » Wed Dec 18, 2019 8:10 pm

Well exactly, the more common line was "tee hee hee, he flunked his A levels (as if nobody else ever did) and this proves that he is thick". God only knows what those people would say if Angela Rayner got the gig - though it looks like she won't be putting her name forward (more's the pity)
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Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Brexit tea leaves

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Wed Dec 18, 2019 9:41 pm

Starmer went to the same school as me - there are a number of former pupils that might be a better bet - Ray Mears, Norman Cook (aka Fatboy Slim), David Walliams and Romesh Ranganathan...

Shouldn't one of the Eagles be interested?