English Chess Forum

Nick Ivell wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:10 pm

In my view, the natural way for us to pronounce Alekhine is with stress on the first syllable. After all, we don't even try to pronounce Sharapova properly (stress on the second syllable, I believe).

I remember being taught to say "Il-yum-ZHI-nov".

To this day I know very few others who do. Most chicken out by saying "KIR-san".

A pretty comprehensive list of potential traps for the unwary can be found here, courtesy of Bill Wall. Looks as though, more often than not, it's a question of where the stress(es) should fall, rather than actual pronunciation.

Kevin Thurlow wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 24, 2020 9:22 am

Al-yekk-in, which I believe is the Russian pronunciation?

My erstwhile Ukrainian club mate told me it is pronounced Al-yokk-in.

Nick Ivell wrote: ↑

Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:10 pm

In my view, the natural way for us to pronounce Alekhine is with stress on the first syllable. After all, we don't even try to pronounce Sharapova properly (stress on the second syllable, I believe).

In the case of living people it seems a bit disrespectful to make no effort to get it right. I once heard a Bulgarian friend telling someone that her surname was "NikolOVa". She admitted to me that it is actually NikOLLova, but she had got so used to British people getting it wrong that she gave in and pronounced it wrong herself. I found this rather embarrassing.

Jacques Parry wrote: ↑

Fri Jun 26, 2020 9:26 am

In the case of living people it seems a bit disrespectful to make no effort to get it right.

Those Slavic names do seem to be harder than most, often having what seems to Westerners a counter-intuitive stress pattern. But as Jacques says, you've got to make the effort. I've been taking extra trouble lately to get Maori names and words right. (Here in NZ, there's an increasing groundswell of opinion - rightly so - that this is long overdue. Again. not easy. The letters used to spell them, as is the case in many other languages, can only at best be approximations to the actual sounds.) And I try to do the same in other languages too (though not to the point of calling Paris "Paree") even if it can sound a bit pretentious at times.

"And I try to do the same in other languages too (though not to the point of calling Paris "Paree") even if it can sound a bit pretentious at times."

That makes sense (and the rest of your post). There's no need to say "Paree" in an English-speaking country, or Schwarzwald instead of Black Forest unless it's more appropriate to your audience.

I had a German boss who had spent a year or so working in Australia and we had an interesting conversation shortly after he arrived.

Me - "Any news on that IT problem?"
Him - "I have a meeting about it this arvo."

For the uninitiated, "arvo" is Australian slang for "afternoon".

My favourite name thing was hearing an American chap called "Roentgen" talk and he pronounced it "Rent-genn". Apparently, he thought the "oe" was the Greek diphthong as in Oedipus and oestrogen (the old non-scientific spelling of estrogen), rather than the Germanic "o-umlaut", pronounded "err".

Kevin Thurlow wrote: ↑

Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:11 pm

My favourite name thing was hearing an American chap called "Roentgen" talk and he pronounced it "Rent-genn".

My favourite is an Indian (probably) lecturer referring to "I-terra-tors" while explaining how loop constructs work in programming languages.

I make no claim for consistency here.

I'm relaxed about Alekhine being pronounced with incorrect stress.

But Medici with stress on the penultimate syllable? That gets me pulling my hair out.

Yes, I know I should have more important things to worry about...

Jacques Parry wrote: ↑

Fri Jun 26, 2020 9:26 am

I once heard a Bulgarian friend telling someone that her surname was "NikolOVa". She admitted to me that it is actually NikOLLova, but she had got so used to British people getting it wrong that she gave in and pronounced it wrong herself. I found this rather embarrassing.

I once had a Scottish friend whose surname was Lamont. I'm sure we all know the correct pronunciation (let's be honest, I didn't). He told me that after living in England for a short while he just gave up and started pronouncing it wrongly (as if it was French) himself.

I remember how one of our Latvian players, Oleg, at our club tried to pronounce Torquay when he looked at an entry form for the British Chess Championships.
He pronounced it the same way it is spelt, so I explained to him that you pronounce it as Tor-key.
When Oleg also saw an entry form on display for a Castle Chess Congress at Potters Bar, he thought Potters Bar was a pub and questioned which town the tournament was being played in.

I recently drove through a village called Stoughton and have no idea how it's pronounced. Storton? Stuffton? Stowton? Stooton? Stoaton? I must find out...

Kevin Thurlow wrote: ↑

Fri Dec 04, 2020 6:10 pm

I recently drove through a village called Stoughton and have no idea how it's pronounced. Storton? Stuffton? Stowton? Stooton? Stoaton? I must find out...

More on Stoughton

As far as I can tell, it should be "STOH-tun". I've fairly clear memories of the publishers Hodder and Stoughton being referred to by that pronunciation (Mrs C used to be in the book trade).

My Stoughton is in Somerset!

Stoughton is an area of Guildford (which I lived in years ago) and we pronounced it to rhyme with the bough of a tree or stout (as in fat).