The English Language

A section to discuss matters not related to Chess in particular.
Arshad Ali
Posts: 704
Joined: Mon Feb 22, 2010 12:27 pm

Re: commodity

Post by Arshad Ali » Fri May 16, 2014 1:45 pm

Clive Blackburn wrote:I haven't read Stalin's book but I have read Animal Farm if that helps:-)
It will suffice -- Orwell's book is the popular version of Trotsky's The Revolution Betrayed. Note that by the end the animals can't distinguish between the pigs and the humans. Also note that the altercation between the pigs and the humans is over a game of cards -- but it could just as well have been chess.

soheil_hooshdaran
Posts: 2903
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2013 5:24 pm

Re: commodity

Post by soheil_hooshdaran » Sat May 17, 2014 4:24 pm

Arshad Ali wrote:
Michael Farthing wrote:Well at least I know why my sacrifices keep on back-firing. Not done the Marxist analysis properly.
The "profit motive" comes into chess -- what will my return on investment be if I sac a pawn/piece/the exchange? If I exchange pawns and/or pieces, do I come out ahead? Transactions abound in chess. That's why Trevanian, in his novel Shibumi, describes chess as a game for merchants:
What Go is to philosophers and warriors, chess is to accountants and merchants.
You mean Seirawan meant to liken Sacrifices to investments?

Barry Sandercock
Posts: 1356
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2012 10:52 am

Re: commodity

Post by Barry Sandercock » Sat May 17, 2014 5:24 pm

Yes, you sacrifice something and hope to get something back.

Arshad Ali
Posts: 704
Joined: Mon Feb 22, 2010 12:27 pm

Re: commodity

Post by Arshad Ali » Sat May 17, 2014 9:06 pm

soheil_hooshdaran wrote:You mean Seirawan meant to liken Sacrifices to investments?
I'm afraid so. The Americans see everything in market terms. Whenever they give something they expect more back. Altruism, compassion, aesthetics are utterly alien to them.

soheil_hooshdaran
Posts: 2903
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2013 5:24 pm

Re: commodity

Post by soheil_hooshdaran » Wed May 21, 2014 7:48 pm

OK. 'commodity' is an article of commerce. What is a 'calculable' commodity then?

Barry Sandercock
Posts: 1356
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2012 10:52 am

Re: commodity

Post by Barry Sandercock » Wed May 21, 2014 7:53 pm

A commodity that can be assessed.

soheil_hooshdaran
Posts: 2903
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2013 5:24 pm

Re: commodity

Post by soheil_hooshdaran » Wed May 21, 2014 8:23 pm

Barry Sandercock wrote:A commodity that can be assessed.
Why can't it be judged?If not, you'd not have made it

Arshad Ali
Posts: 704
Joined: Mon Feb 22, 2010 12:27 pm

Re: commodity

Post by Arshad Ali » Thu May 22, 2014 1:48 am

The "calculable" part is redundant -- anything whose value can't be assessed is not a commodity by definition. Marx goes into this in more detail in Vol.1 of Das Kapital.

soheil_hooshdaran
Posts: 2903
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2013 5:24 pm

Re: commodity

Post by soheil_hooshdaran » Thu May 22, 2014 6:19 am

Arshad Ali wrote:The "calculable" part is redundant -- anything whose value can't be assessed is not a commodity by definition. Marx goes into this in more detail in Vol.1 of Das Kapital.
Yes, exactly.
We say 'an expensive/a worthless commodity' for example. But May be he meant something else, right?

Michael Flatt
Posts: 1235
Joined: Tue Jul 02, 2013 7:36 am
Location: Hertfordshire

Re: commodity

Post by Michael Flatt » Thu May 22, 2014 7:39 am

As a chess player you will doubtless be aware of other aspects of a sacrifice beyond the mere "counting of points."

The phsychological impact of an unexpected sacrifice can be decisive. Being on the wrong side of a speculative sacrifice can cause doubt and uncertainty in one's mind and result in a the loss of considerable time on the clock.

User avatar
Michael Farthing
Posts: 1873
Joined: Fri Apr 04, 2014 1:28 pm
Location: Morecambe, Europe

Re: commodity

Post by Michael Farthing » Thu May 22, 2014 9:00 am

Michael Flatt wrote:As a chess player you will doubtless be aware of other aspects of a sacrifice beyond the mere "counting of points."

The phsychological impact of an unexpected sacrifice can be decisive. Being on the wrong side of a speculative sacrifice can cause doubt and uncertainty in one's mind and result in a the loss of considerable time on the clock.
Indeed, the value conferred by saving of time is one of the major flaws in the Labour Theory of Value.
Rejoiner

Arshad Ali
Posts: 704
Joined: Mon Feb 22, 2010 12:27 pm

Re: commodity

Post by Arshad Ali » Thu May 22, 2014 6:02 pm

Michael Farthing wrote:Indeed, the value conferred by saving of time is one of the major flaws in the Labour Theory of Value.
But as Marx points out, the value conferred tends to be ephemeral (though every capitalist goes after that ephemeral edge by relentlessly pursuing tech improvements that lead to less need for labor).

soheil_hooshdaran
Posts: 2903
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2013 5:24 pm

Chess Timing

Post by soheil_hooshdaran » Fri May 23, 2014 10:46 am

Hi.
What does it mean that:
The type of game produced by open positions will teach you about timing and will introduce you to the tactics necessary to deal with the lack of development and an exposed king.

?Thanks in advance

User avatar
Joey Stewart
Posts: 1113
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2007 2:35 pm
Location: All Of Them
Contact:

Re: Chess Timing

Post by Joey Stewart » Fri May 23, 2014 11:11 am

It means playing the moves in the right order, and learning to spot these correct orders in a position.

For example, a knight could give check, followed by a queen sacrifice and you would have nothing. If you play that queen sacrifice first it will be checkmate.
Two possible orders, but only one is correct.
Lose one queen and it is a disaster, Lose 1000 queens and it is just a statistic.

Geoff Chandler
Posts: 2087
Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2009 1:36 pm
Location: Under Cover
Contact:

Re: Chess Timing

Post by Geoff Chandler » Fri May 23, 2014 12:26 pm

Hi soheil

I'd usually associate 'timing' with a Black set up where he is facing
a mass of pawns of central pawns. King's Indian, Pirc, Modern, Hedgehog...

There the timing of the thrust ...c5, ...d5, ...e5 is important.
It has to be timed right - played at the correct moment.

Black playing d5 in a Sicilian has to be timed well.

You sometimes see - "Black has timed his counter-attack just right."
Too soon and White could have handled it, too late and Black gets mated.

"The type of game produced by open positions will teach you about timing..."

There may be a slight piece of mis-translation here.

In open positions it is 'Tempo' that is the important factor.

Post Reply