EU referendum aftermath

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NickFaulks
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Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by NickFaulks » Wed Jul 13, 2016 6:01 pm

I'm getting really tired of hearing Scots insisting that they must be allowed special treatment when Brexit terms are decided, on the basis that they voted not to leave. They were given the option of becoming an independent nation quite recently and for reasons which mystified me they said no thanks. When they chose to remain in the UK, they agreed to accept the major foreign policy decisions of the UK government.

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Michael Farthing
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Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by Michael Farthing » Wed Jul 13, 2016 7:28 pm

NickFaulks wrote:I'm getting really tired of hearing Scots insisting that they must be allowed special treatment when Brexit terms are decided, on the basis that they voted not to leave. They were given the option of becoming an independent nation quite recently and for reasons which mystified me they said no thanks. When they chose to remain in the UK, they agreed to accept the major foreign policy decisions of the UK government.
.. but retained the right to oppose such policies and seek to have them changed and also retained the right to revisit past decisions and once again campaign to leave. No decision previously taken has a minimum time before it can be revisited. As far as I am concerned the Brexit decision was wrong and I would consider any legal method of overturning that decision as being legitimate. You can't possibly disagree with that - it's a tautology.

PeterFarr
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Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by PeterFarr » Wed Jul 13, 2016 8:56 pm

Michael Farthing wrote:
NickFaulks wrote:I'm getting really tired of hearing Scots insisting that they must be allowed special treatment when Brexit terms are decided, on the basis that they voted not to leave. They were given the option of becoming an independent nation quite recently and for reasons which mystified me they said no thanks. When they chose to remain in the UK, they agreed to accept the major foreign policy decisions of the UK government.
.. but retained the right to oppose such policies and seek to have them changed and also retained the right to revisit past decisions and once again campaign to leave. No decision previously taken has a minimum time before it can be revisited. As far as I am concerned the Brexit decision was wrong and I would consider any legal method of overturning that decision as being legitimate. You can't possibly disagree with that - it's a tautology.
Well quite, Brexiteers wouldn't have accepted a Remain vote as final, they would have continued the lies and smears against the EU until the last syllable of recorded time. Yet remainers are suppose to lie down and take the ruination of Britain without a peep.

Mick Norris
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Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by Mick Norris » Wed Jul 13, 2016 9:27 pm

PeterFarr wrote:
Michael Farthing wrote:
NickFaulks wrote:I'm getting really tired of hearing Scots insisting that they must be allowed special treatment when Brexit terms are decided, on the basis that they voted not to leave. They were given the option of becoming an independent nation quite recently and for reasons which mystified me they said no thanks. When they chose to remain in the UK, they agreed to accept the major foreign policy decisions of the UK government.
.. but retained the right to oppose such policies and seek to have them changed and also retained the right to revisit past decisions and once again campaign to leave. No decision previously taken has a minimum time before it can be revisited. As far as I am concerned the Brexit decision was wrong and I would consider any legal method of overturning that decision as being legitimate. You can't possibly disagree with that - it's a tautology.
Well quite, Brexiteers wouldn't have accepted a Remain vote as final, they would have continued the lies and smears against the EU until the last syllable of recorded time. Yet remainers are suppose to lie down and take the ruination of Britain without a peep.
Exactly
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Ray Sayers

Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by Ray Sayers » Wed Jul 13, 2016 10:28 pm

NickFaulks wrote:I'm getting really tired of hearing Scots insisting that they must be allowed special treatment when Brexit terms are decided, on the basis that they voted not to leave. They were given the option of becoming an independent nation quite recently and for reasons which mystified me they said no thanks. When they chose to remain in the UK, they agreed to accept the major foreign policy decisions of the UK government.
I was dead against Scotland leaving the rest of the UK in the original Referendum for Scottish independence (not that I had a vote, of course!).

Now, I think they have a right to ask for another referendum for Scottish independence. One of the major factors for Scotland staying in the Union was that they would remain part of the EU, something which they were told was at risk if they left the Union. That isn't the case any more - the opposite is true. I think they have every right to be, to put it mildly, 'miffed'.

NickFaulks
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Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by NickFaulks » Wed Jul 13, 2016 10:37 pm

Ray Sayers wrote: One of the major factors for Scotland staying in the Union was that they would remain part of the EU, something which they were told was at risk if they left the Union.
Who told them that?

Dragoljub Sudar
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Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by Dragoljub Sudar » Wed Jul 13, 2016 10:52 pm

Regardless of whether you supported or opposed the UK leaving the EU, it's important to remember that in 1993 we were denied a referendum on the Maastrict treaty, which paved the path to political union. That was a major mistake by, er, Major. We have had to wait 23 very long years before finally being given a chance to express our view, and it was a clear democratic decision.

As for Scotland, they are part of the UK, and the UK voted to leave. So they will just have to accept the result, or try to have another independence referendum at some point and if the country votes to leave the UK they could then apply to join the EU (and adopt the Euro as a result).

At least May has had the good sense to appoint the incredibly able David Davis as the Secretary of State for Brexit. There may well be a bumpy road ahead but ultimately this country will prosper while the EU continues to destroy itself.

Mick Norris
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Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by Mick Norris » Wed Jul 13, 2016 10:54 pm

Boris as Foreign Secretary should be, er, interesting
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NickFaulks
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Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by NickFaulks » Wed Jul 13, 2016 11:15 pm

Michael Farthing wrote: but retained the right to oppose such policies and seek to have them changed
No. Scotland staying in UK and leaving EU with the rest of the nation - fine. Scotland leaving UK and staying in EU - fine. But they have to make up their minds. Scotland having best of both worlds ( as they see it ), staying in UK but also staying in EU - forget it.

If Cameron had been faced with this conundrum he would have waffled, which has always been his primary skill. I'm not May's biggest fan, but I think she is straighforward enough to tell the Scots their future.

Mick Norris
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Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by Mick Norris » Thu Jul 14, 2016 9:28 am

Dragoljub Sudar wrote:Regardless of whether you supported or opposed the UK leaving the EU, it's important to remember that in 1993 we were denied a referendum on the Maastrict treaty, which paved the path to political union. That was a major mistake by, er, Major. We have had to wait 23 very long years before finally being given a chance to express our view, and it was a clear democratic decision.
Indeed, after a campaign in which both sides lied, over 27% eligible didn't vote, less than 36% voted to leave :roll:

Or alternatively, we have had more than 1 referendum and this was the first when we voted no :wink:

Anyway, we will get a sort of say in 2020 at the General Election
In March 1975 Margaret Thatcher quoted Clement Attlee that referendums are:

“a device of dictators and demagogues”
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NickFaulks
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Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by NickFaulks » Thu Jul 14, 2016 9:47 am

Mick Norris wrote:
In March 1975 Margaret Thatcher quoted Clement Attlee that referendums are:

“a device of dictators and demagogues”
She did go on to qualify Attlee's quote by saying that a referendum should not be ruled out on an issue of great consequence which divided voters but on which the big parties were agreed.

Mick Norris
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Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by Mick Norris » Thu Jul 14, 2016 11:19 am

Sacked by May so far - Osborne, Gove, Letwin, Morgan, Whittingdale

The Cuban economy minister got the boot too :lol:
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Mick Norris
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Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by Mick Norris » Thu Jul 14, 2016 11:26 am

MartinCarpenter wrote:Doubt the party is rich enough for starters :)
Legal action underway
Labour deputy leader Tom Watson called the legal challenge "very unhelpful".
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Angus French
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Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by Angus French » Thu Jul 14, 2016 12:11 pm

The Daily Mail has a story that Tom Watson recently received £200,000 from Max Mosley. Something I've been wondering about is: how helpful has Tom Watson been to the Labour Party in the last 10 months?

NickFaulks
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Re: EU referendum aftermath

Post by NickFaulks » Thu Jul 14, 2016 12:59 pm

Contrary to rumours, Jeremy Hunt remains in charge of dismantling the NHS. So much for our new PM's fine words yesterday.

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