EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

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John McKenna
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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by John McKenna » Wed Jun 08, 2016 3:16 pm

Thanks, Barry. That sounds ominous for our man in Yerevan.
To find a for(u)m that accommodates the mess, that is the task of the artist now. (Samuel Beckett)

John McKenna
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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by John McKenna » Wed Jun 08, 2016 6:21 pm

Barry Sandercock wrote:He's made the time control, but his position looks not too easy to play.
It looks like Gayson,P (2122) 0-1 Vaganian,R (2577)

After 47 moves Vaganian had a winning position and bags of time so duly won, presumably.
To find a for(u)m that accommodates the mess, that is the task of the artist now. (Samuel Beckett)

Tim Harding
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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by Tim Harding » Fri Jun 10, 2016 8:05 pm

Catching up with the Seniors tonight after two days of the Grand Prix rapid.

In the 50+, Peter Gayson won today and has 3.5/6. Tomorrow he has White against WGM Svetlana Mednikova, the 2014 Women's World Senior Champion (that's how she got her promotion from WIM). It will be on board 8 so should be live.

Vaganian won today to catch up with the leader Kalegin who drew. They both have 5/6 and play tomorrow.
Four players including Sturua are on 4.5 so there's likely to be a decisive game between Sturua and Vaganian in one of the last two rounds.

In the 65+ the biggest surprise yesterday was that Vasiukov and his team-mate Kupreichik played a real game which was won by Vasiukov who had been half a point behind (chiefly because of short draws with other Russians).

That meant there were seven joint leaders on 4/5 with Kupreichik half a point behind.
Today Sveshnikov won and so did IM Bogdanov so they have 5 and play tomorrow. Sveshnikov has Black tomorrow and if he doesn't lose I would expect him to win the tournament.
Mischuchkov-Vasiukov and Kupreichik-Gaprindashvili were drawn.

Board 2 tomorrow sees Danish FM (and correspondence grandmaster) Bent Sorensen have White against Mischuchkov. So I'll be rooting for the Dane who is a really friendly guy and was in my hotel at the World Individuals last year. Apart from losing a tough fight with Sveshnikov (quite excusable) he has been doing really well and has a chance tomorrow.

Gaprindashvili will play FM Gruzmann who has also joined the chasing group on 4.5. So Nona has a good chance of second place at least, since she already played Sveshnikov and Vasiukov.

I'm sorry to see Roger Scowen lost today; his opponent was an Armenian woman with no FIDE rating so she was probably quite strong really.

Tomorrow Roger has White against Russian FM Grigorij Vagner who is 88 (or will be later this year); they each have 1/6.
If you are reading this, Roger, beware! You should be able to beat Vagner but he is quite tricky. He was once over 2300 and when I beat him in the World's last year he signed for the reverse result on the scoresheet (0-1 instead of 1-0) but fortunately I spotted the trick and corrected it. He played Chigorin's Defence to the Queen's Gambit and if you PM me I will send you the game...
Tim Harding
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Stewart Reuben
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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by Stewart Reuben » Sat Jun 11, 2016 1:31 pm

When the 50+ tournaments were first mooted, Craig Pritchett wrote to me and pointed out that they had been advertised as being for players 50-64. I communicated with the relevant officials and it was rapidly changed to 50+ and 65+. It is not surprising Vaganian preferred to play with younger, and stronger, opponents. The prize money isn't very high. He may have the ambition to win both titles.

Craig Pritchett
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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by Craig Pritchett » Sat Jun 11, 2016 9:40 pm

I am also surprised that anyone should be remotely surprised that Vaganyan, who can play in either event, should wish to play 50+ Euro senior ch rather than 65+.If I'd gone, I'd almost certainly have chosen 50+ rather than 65+, too (and I am 67).

The FIDE/ECU decision (since 2014) to replace the 60+ events by 65+ events remains, to my mind, not just ill-thought-through and arbitrary (no one asked the players or worse, even the federations in advance about this) but also actually inimical to maximising entrants.

It has annoyed players like me, who feel that 65+ is too old to set the age qualification ... I want to play against younger oldies and consider that the old 60+ events (so successful for over two decades) offered much more competitive and naturally 'senior' championships.

It has annoyed quite a few of the old 60-64 year-olds, some of whom simply stopped playing seniors international chess as they felt it unjust that they should suddenly be 'forced' to play with 50 year-olds (one of these, by the way, is the current 65+ world champion, and a former old-style, 60+ world champion, who flatly told me two years ago that he wouldn't turn up to play 50+ players in 2014 but would wait till he was 65+ to play again in seniors events in 2015).

I have no problem with the 'new' 50+ events. But I do feel the old 60+ events should be rapidly reintroduced to all-round economic and competitive benefit.

Viktor Korchnoi (RIP), who only deigned to play in his first senior championship at the age of 75 (he won the then 60+ world title), would, I am sure, have hardly expected Vaganyan to play in any event other than the 50+ championship at Yerevan!

Chris Rice
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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by Chris Rice » Sat Jun 11, 2016 11:39 pm

Interesting, but there are other possible reasons why Vaganian night have gone for the 50+ such as he had two options and decided that he didn't want to stop Sveshnikov winning the 65+ or it may be he simply didn't realise he was eligible for the 65+. Then again he may well believe that winning the 65+ wouldn't be much of an achievement but I find it difficult to believe he would think that. Looking at the strength of the two tournaments the 50+ is a bit stronger admittedly as (taking Vaganian out of it), it has 1 - 2500, 5-2400s and 2 - 2300s whereas the 65+ has 1 -2500 2 - 2400s and 4 - 2300s. Not a great deal of difference is there? Is it the case that if a few more 2500s and/or 2400s had entered the 65+ that Vaganian might have chosen that section?

Regarding the sections I would agree that a 50+ 60+ and even a 70+ championship split might be better but I don't know the basis for the claims that the 60+ section was so successful or that the 50+ 65+ has reduced the numbers.

One other thing I was wondering was why they are played simultaneously? Under the current criteria of 50+ and 65+ then wouldn't it have been good to see Vaganian have the option to play both back to back and possibly become a double world champion?

Anyway looking forward to Vaganian's Round 8 pairing vs Sturua which could well decide which way the 50+ will go http://chess-results.com/tnr218917.aspx ... =30&wi=984

Keith Arkell
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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by Keith Arkell » Sat Jun 11, 2016 11:49 pm

I would also have loved to again gone for the 50+ title, to try to add to my collection of Gold followed by Bronze, but I wasn't invited, and couldn't afford to pay the the costs myself. Frustrating, but that's life :-(

Chris Rice
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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by Chris Rice » Sun Jun 12, 2016 7:05 am

Keith Arkell wrote:I would also have loved to again gone for the 50+ title, to try to add to my collection of Gold followed by Bronze, but I wasn't invited, and couldn't afford to pay the the costs myself. Frustrating, but that's life :-(
Judging by the field I suspect you were not the only GM in this position as the costs are not insignificant. You're a popular guy Keith so my guess is that if you tried crowdfunding it you would get the required sponsorship easily. http://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/?utm_expid ... e.co.uk%2F

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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by Tim Harding » Sun Jun 12, 2016 12:20 pm

The penultimate round in Yerevan started noon our time.
On board 4 in the 65+ already Mischuchkov-Gaprindashvili drawn in 9 moves. So they are both on 5.5/8.
It seems that what Nona wants, Nona gets. This guarantees her the women's title and a good shot at a main prize in the last round.
Today:
Sveshnikov (5.5) v Vasiukov (5)
Veremeichik (5) v Bogdanov (5.5)
Kupreichik (5) v Sorensen (Denmark, 5)
Gruzmann (Germany, 5) v Svedchikov (5), the latter a former KGB man, I'm told.

Vasiukov played the French, presumably having prepared for Sveshnikov's customary 3 e5 but Sveshnikov played 3 exd5 instead!

Our man Scowen did beat Vagner yesterday to double his score and avoid the bye.

In the 50+,
Vaganian (6.5) v Sturua (5.5)
Legky (5.5) v Bagaturov (5.5)
Movsziszian (4.5) v Kalegin (5.5)

Peter Gayson (on +1) plays WGM Strutinskaia on board 9 so just misses the live boards.

PS: Sveshnikov-Vasiukov agreed drawn in 10 moves.
Tim Harding
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Kevin Thurlow
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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Sun Jun 12, 2016 1:14 pm

"It has annoyed quite a few of the old 60-64 year-olds, some of whom simply stopped playing seniors international chess as they felt it unjust that they should suddenly be 'forced' to play with 50 year-olds (one of these, by the way, is the current 65+ world champion, and a former old-style, 60+ world champion, who flatly told me two years ago that he wouldn't turn up to play 50+ players in 2014 but would wait till he was 65+ to play again in seniors events in 2015)."

Yes - I quite agree. This one decided that he might not even bother to compete when he did reach 65.

Chris Rice
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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by Chris Rice » Sun Jun 12, 2016 1:15 pm

Tim Harding wrote: In the 50+,
Vaganian (6.5) v Sturua (5.5)
Legky (5.5) v Bagaturov (5.5)
Movsziszian (4.5) v Kalegin (5.5)
I assume these standings were taken from the Chess24 site which seems to have Vaganian at 6.5/8 when he's only played 7 games as the official site has these pairings and scores? http://chess-results.com/tnr218917.aspx ... =30&wi=984

Vaganian (5.5) v Sturua (5.5)
Legky (5) v Bagaturov (5.5)
Movsziszian (4.5) v Kalegin (5.5)

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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by Tim Harding » Sun Jun 12, 2016 5:06 pm

Chris Rice wrote:
Tim Harding wrote: In the 50+,
Vaganian (6.5) v Sturua (5.5)
Legky (5.5) v Bagaturov (5.5)
Movsziszian (4.5) v Kalegin (5.5)
I assume these standings were taken from the Chess24 site which seems to have Vaganian at 6.5/8 when he's only played 7 games as the official site has these pairings and scores? http://chess-results.com/tnr218917.aspx ... =30&wi=984

Vaganian (5.5) v Sturua (5.5)
Legky (5) v Bagaturov (5.5)
Movsziszian (4.5) v Kalegin (5.5)
Actually you are right of course. Having been out all day yesterday, I forgot that Chess24 had awarded Vaganian an extra point early in the tournament and they never corrected it. Also for some strange reason they had him on board 3 today,
Anyway...
Vaganian drew with Sturua and so did Legky with Bagaturov, which makes three players on 6 since Movsziszian beat Kalegin.

In the 65+, the top five boards were drawn.
Meshkov on board 6 had an easy pairing and won so he has appeared from nowhere to join the chasing group on 5.5.
Round 9:
Kupreichik (5.5) v Sveshnikov (6)
Bogdanov (6) v Nona (5.5)
Vasiukov (5.5) v Veremeichik (5.5)
Meshkov (5.5) v Gruzmann (5.5)
Shvedchikov (5.5) v Mishuchkov (5.5)
and
Sorensen (5.5) v his compatriot Jens Kolbak who is on 5.
The English player Scowen won his game to move to 3 points.

The 50+ round 8 seems to be still in progress, or there is a delay. Gayson's result is not up yet and there is no final round 9 draw on chess-results.com at the time of writing.
Tim Harding
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Tim Harding
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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by Tim Harding » Sun Jun 12, 2016 5:38 pm

Update. Peter Gayson drew and remains on +1.
The final round draw for the 50+ is now up:

Bagaturov (6)-Vaganian (6)
Sturua (6)-Yuferev (5/5)
Kalegin (5.5)-Legky (5.5)
Hayrapetyan (5)-Movzsiszian (5.5)
Tim Harding
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Keith Arkell
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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by Keith Arkell » Sun Jun 12, 2016 9:09 pm

Chris Rice wrote: Judging by the field I suspect you were not the only GM in this position as the costs are not insignificant. You're a popular guy Keith so my guess is that if you tried crowdfunding it you would get the required sponsorship easily. http://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/?utm_expid ... e.co.uk%2F
Thanks for the link, Chris. Definitely worth a go for expensive stuff in the future. 2 years ago people were exceptionally kind when I appealed on here, and it was entirely thanks to them that I was then able to go to Porto and get gold.

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Re: EU Senior Individual Champs 2016 Yerevan

Post by Tim Harding » Sun Jun 12, 2016 11:04 pm

For those watching the Yerevan tournaments online, the start time of the last round appears to be 8am BST.
Armenia is apparently three hours ahead of London.
Tim Harding
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