Senior opportunities in 2018

Information and discussion on all matters relating to Seniors Chess.
Tim Harding
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by Tim Harding » Mon Apr 23, 2018 3:14 pm

Fake news, fake World Senior Championships, whatever next?

I guess if you want a nice chess holiday without being concerned about your FIDE rating this could be the way to go.

I will add this to my Seniors calendar on chessmail.com next time I update the site.
Meanwhile I put up a link to pictures and results of the EU Senior Teams which ended yesterday in Poland.

http://www.chessmail.com/seniors/Seniors-news.html
Tim Harding
Historian and Kibitzer

Author of 'British Chess Literature to 1914', Joseph Henry Blackburne: A Chess Biography', and 'Eminent Victorian Chess Players'
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Phil Neatherway
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by Phil Neatherway » Mon Apr 23, 2018 10:55 pm

Tim,
you might want to remove that Finkland typo!

Russia (led by GM Balashov) won the 65+ title, also winning every match. Germany finished second (7 wins) anhead of Sweden-1 who took third place with five matches won and two drawn. Finkland-1 were fourth and Scotland fifth.

Tim Harding
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by Tim Harding » Tue Apr 24, 2018 11:35 am

Thanks for the correction Phil; I am going to fix it now.

Also adding details of the ACO event mentioned above and the upcoming Hessische Senior Open in early May (no English version available sadly) and the Olomouc congress of the Czech Tour which includes a senior event.

I am pleased to note that our calendar page is starting to come up high on Google searches for information about senior tournaments.
http://www.chessmail.com/seniors/Seniors-calendar.html

The revised version of these pages should be posted by noon today.

If people will send me information about other upcoming senior events then I will add them.
Tim Harding
Historian and Kibitzer

Author of 'British Chess Literature to 1914', Joseph Henry Blackburne: A Chess Biography', and 'Eminent Victorian Chess Players'
http://www.chessmail.com

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by Roger de Coverly » Wed May 30, 2018 8:42 am

Tim Harding wrote:
Mon Apr 23, 2018 3:14 pm
fake World Senior Championships, whatever next?
FIDE it seems have noticed.

http://www.fide.com/component/content/a ... hipsq.html

There appears to be an implied threat to organisers and participants.
FIDE is obliged to protect all member National Chess Federations and their players from practices of misleading and fake “World Championships”. The relevant FIDE administrative bodies will soon examine the issue in detail and in accordance with the FIDE regulations for the registration and licensing of organisers, players, trainers and arbiters.

Alex Holowczak
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by Alex Holowczak » Wed May 30, 2018 2:42 pm

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 8:42 am
Tim Harding wrote:
Mon Apr 23, 2018 3:14 pm
fake World Senior Championships, whatever next?
FIDE it seems have noticed.

http://www.fide.com/component/content/a ... hipsq.html

There appears to be an implied threat to organisers and participants.
FIDE is obliged to protect all member National Chess Federations and their players from practices of misleading and fake “World Championships”. The relevant FIDE administrative bodies will soon examine the issue in detail and in accordance with the FIDE regulations for the registration and licensing of organisers, players, trainers and arbiters.
FIDE posted news articles about this in the past.

March 2011: http://www.fide.com/component/content/a ... ution.html
April 2012: http://www.fide.com/component/content/a ... ment-.html

My impression is that the English people who played in the ACO World Amateur in Kos in 2018 both realise, and don't care, that it isn't the official World Amateur. They just like the location in Kos, and might even play in the same tournament under a different name.

It does seem strange for FIDE to say that they want to "protect all member National Chess Federations and their players" in one sentence, and then imply that they are considering withdrawing the licences of the players they are trying to protect in the next.

I'm sure it misleads people. But the ACO's World Amateur attracted more entries than FIDE's official World Amateur in 2018, which suggests the ACO event is better than the FIDE event. That should be the thing FIDE worries about - why is an unrated, unofficial, imitation event doing better than an official event?

Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Wed May 30, 2018 5:57 pm

"That should be the thing FIDE worries about - why is an unrated, unofficial, imitation event doing better than an official event?"

A very good question... Don't official FIDE events demand higher-than-necessary fees from the organizers and first class travel for various officials etc? The players end up paying for that, so the unofficial events can maybe treat the players better? Does Stan Vaughan still run a World Championship?

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by Roger de Coverly » Wed May 30, 2018 7:21 pm

Alex Holowczak wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 2:42 pm
That should be the thing FIDE worries about - why is an unrated, unofficial, imitation event doing better than an official event?
It's not the same structure, with the ACO version having an upper rating limit and several sections below that.

Stewart Reuben
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by Stewart Reuben » Wed May 30, 2018 8:42 pm

But the ACO's World Amateur attracted more entries than FIDE's official World Amateur in 2018, which suggests the ACO event is better than the FIDE event.
The FIDE World Amateur Championship is restricted to plyers rated under 2000 or unrated. That was the structure I invented in Hastings 1995. The ACO event goes much higher. So, of course it is likely there will be more entries. Alex, please research it and see whether the ACO U2000 attracts more entries than he FIDE World Amateur.
The ACO event should NOT be allowed to take advantage of the FIDE Rating System to determine who is eligible. I think I am right, they don't even pay the rating fee.
I haven't looked at the fees for the FIDE World Amateur for some time, but I doubt they are particularly high.

David Gilbert
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by David Gilbert » Thu May 31, 2018 12:23 am

I think Alex is right. This year in Cagliari the FIDE World Amateur Championship ran four sections: under 2300; under 2000; under 1700; and under 1700 women. There were a total of 245 participants. At the ACO World Amateur Championships in Kos in 2018 there were 308 participants. I’d take a guess that they were accompanied by another 150 partners and family members, because the venue doubles for a fantastic beach holiday, with chess. There were seven sections: under 2401; Under 2201; then down in 200 points stages until you reach under 1200. So you get to play people around your own strength and it makes for good competition.

There was no women's section, but all the female players were presented with colourful scarves. Even Judit Polgár got one. As did Chile’s Maria Jose Rescaglio Yarur (Stewart has praised her before), who was runner up in her section. She sang three songs at the presentation and earlier that day we were given an advance viewing of the video accompanying a song from her new album, out next month, about losing a game against the Caro Kann with a chorus that includes references to Capablanca! Now that’s a first isn’t it?

The thing is while the ACO takes the higher of your FIDE rating or your converted national grade, FIDE allow players with high national grades but no FIDE rating to play in the Minor Under 1700. Which hardly seems fair. There’s a excellent (and largely positive) report from a South African player at the FIDE World Amateur Championships in 2016 who reports “We both played in the Under 1700 section, which was for players with a published FIDE rating less than 1700. Now there were players in this section that had a zero FIDE rating. Hope Mkhumba, who was clear first in the section, has an ECF grading of 191, which is about 2130 FIDE”. (http://www.durbanchessclub.co.za/world-amateur.html)

The experience of Kos has given people the appetite for more of what the ACO serves up, and there are already 81 players (seven from England) signed up to play in Crete in October, and the event was only announced three weeks ago. Oh, don't tell the Norwegians and Bavarians, alcohol is included in the price! There's plenty more detail here - book early. https://amateurchess.com/wp-content/upl ... 18_eng.pdf

Alex Holowczak
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by Alex Holowczak » Thu May 31, 2018 10:25 am

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 7:21 pm
It's not the same structure, with the ACO version having an upper rating limit and several sections below that.
Stewart Reuben wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 8:42 pm
The FIDE World Amateur Championship is restricted to plyers rated under 2000 or unrated. That was the structure I invented in Hastings 1995. The ACO event goes much higher. So, of course it is likely there will be more entries. Alex, please research it and see whether the ACO U2000 attracts more entries than he FIDE World Amateur.
I'm afraid Stewart and Roger are both wrong - the FIDE World Amateur has U2300 and U1700 sections now, with separate sections for women if there are enough entries. There was debate about what the sections other than U2000 should be at the Events Commission meeting at the FIDE Congress in Abu Dhabi, a meeting that both Stewart and I attended.

If more sections is the reason why more people attend the ACO World Amateur, then maybe that's all FIDE has to do to make its event more popular.

Roger de Coverly
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by Roger de Coverly » Thu May 31, 2018 10:51 am

Alex Holowczak wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 10:25 am

If more sections is the reason why more people attend the ACO World Amateur, then maybe that's all FIDE has to do to make its event more popular.
There's more marketing for the ACO events, entry forms at British events for example. You would only find out the when and where of the FIDE event by looking it up on the FIDE or perhaps the ECF websites.

NickFaulks
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by NickFaulks » Thu May 31, 2018 10:58 am

Alex Holowczak wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 10:25 am
If more sections is the reason why more people attend the ACO World Amateur, then maybe that's all FIDE has to do to make its event more popular.
One big problem faced by official FIDE events is that federations tender for them and they move from place to place. Therefore, just because last year's event got rave reviews, that doesn't mean that this year's will be as good. Kos, on the other hand, is established in the calendar as a great event.

Brian Towers
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by Brian Towers » Thu May 31, 2018 10:59 am

FIDE wrote:Our aim is to achieve significant growth in the number of people of all ages participating in chess events at all levels and to develop chess by increasing the level of tournament participation globally.
Surely new tournaments increase "the level of tournament participation globally" and are therefore in alignment with FIDE's aims?
Ah, but I was so much older then. I'm younger than that now.

David Gilbert
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by David Gilbert » Thu May 31, 2018 11:26 am

Roger de Coverly wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 10:51 am

There's more marketing for the ACO events, entry forms at British events for example. You would only find out the when and where of the FIDE event by looking it up on the FIDE or perhaps the ECF websites.
That’s absolutely true. The ACO is reaching out across the world. They take out full page adverts in international chess magazines, including Chess, and there are flyers at most English (and some Scottish) congresses and in some chess clubs in the South. They have strengthened the ACO brand in England and especially across Europe, of course in Germany, but very much so in Switzerland where the writer, and general entrepreneur (and five times married chess player), Alex Guensberg, has been particularly active.

Brendan O'Gorman
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Re: Senior opportunities in 2018

Post by Brendan O'Gorman » Thu May 31, 2018 11:50 am

I can't comment on the FIDE event, but one additional aspect of the Kos event worth noting is the fabulous hotel where it is held. Lovely spacious rooms, mouth-watering and wide-ranging menus available for breakfast, lunch and dinner, and efficient liaison with local tour companies to arrange trips around Kos, nearby islands, and Bodrum in Turkey (a short ferry ride away).

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