Poll: Is the ECF doing a good job?

[Paul Cooksey]

Just out of curiosity, having read the Finance Council thread

[LawrenceCooper]

Just out of curiosity, having read the Finance Council thread

When you say ECF, do you mean Council, the board, the federation as a whole or another definition?

[Michael Farthing]

That depends on what we think it should be doing. I'm of the school of thought that it shouldn't do a lot: its function is to provide an environment in which others can do the providing.

[Chris Fegan]

Just out of curiosity, having read the Finance Council thread

When you say ECF, do you mean Council, the board, the federation as a whole or another definition?

Lawrence

A few points from my perspective on this matter:

1.We are ALL (that is those who pay ECF Membership fees) the ECF. The problem is we do not see ourselves that way as we are constantly and indeed deliberately denied the full rights of membership such as a basic vote by those who have seized control of the ECF Council over many years and keep that control power to themselves and deny us(the paying membership) our basic individual democratic membership rights-that was seen once again in blatant manner at the recent ECF Finance Council meeting.

2.For the reason above and for other obvious democratic deficit reasons the ECF Council is doing a VERY BAD job and needs urgent and radical reform, if not total abolition.

3.ECF Board is doing a reasonable job despite a basic lack of competence in some key individuals who sit on the Board Those same people have also being causing unrest and disharmony within the Board for many years.

4.ECG Board members range from the very good to the totally useless- and we saw this again at the ECF Finance Council when the Director responsible could not even produce accounts for a once a year meeting

5.SOLUTION-a)_Give all ECF Members a vote and thus revitalise the organisation and with the new franchise elect competent Directors to the Board and not some of the time servers that we currently have to endure.

[Roger Lancaster]

Contributors to this forum are, if I can put it as nicely as possible, a self-selected group who often hold strong views on subjects such as this and are not reticent in expressing them. I include myself in this definition. But this surely makes us unrepresentative of the total membership of the ECF which, by and large, does not hold similar strong views and typically knows (and perhaps cares) little of the internal workings of the ECF. Consequently I tend to feel that, while the results of this poll may provide an interesting debating point, they will be of very limited real value.

There is something to Chris's central point, perceived lack of democracy, although one could level the same criticism at many institutions including major quoted companies where shareholder democracy is something of a joke. This has been debated elsewhere on this forum but I would suggest that one drawback of the "give everyone a vote" argument was seen in last year's EU referendum where most voters, whether for or against leaving the EU, based their decisions on incomplete or at worst wholly misleading information. We're all in favour of democracy in principle but I can't honestly see that the full democracy that Chris advocates will lead to better-informed decisions likely to "revitalise the organisation".

[Roger de Coverly]

5.SOLUTION-a)_Give all ECF Members a vote and thus revitalise the organisation and with the new franchise elect competent Directors to the Board and not some of the time servers that we currently have to endure.

It's all very well giving votes to individual members ( member organisations already have votes), but what do you allow them to vote on and how do you make the member organisations give up their voting power?

The Board presented a carefully selected choice of options at the recent Council meeting. One option that wasn't really presented was one where the existing Council structure stays more or less unchanged, but at least some of the Board are directly elected. That might be the President, the non-Exec Chairman and the two other non-Execs.

[JustinHorton]

Those same people have also being causing unrest and disharmony within the Board for many years.

Projection, Chris, projection.

I've voted yes on the grounds that I think it is doing better than it was previously.

[Nick Grey]

Yes we're all doing a good job. Some are doing better than others.
If those that are having the votes at meetings (but not turning up), consult with members seeking views & informing proxies that is fine by me.
Reasoning that it saves on travel expenses.
Shame not being able to untangle BCF, Trust etc as it sounds like ECF is still in silos & not see why we have a BCF too.

[Chris Fegan]

Those same people have also being causing unrest and disharmony within the Board for many years.

Projection, Chris, projection.

No Justin not projection, just the hard bitten experience of attending ECF Board meetings for 18 months and also viewing and reading the e-mail exchanges between Board members that were often vitriolic and indeed downright abusive and as in one infamous case a clear and serious breach of the ECF Code of Conduct.

[Nick Grey]

Yes we are doing a good job.

[IM Jack Rudd]

Shame not being able to untangle BCF, Trust etc as it sounds like ECF is still in silos & not see why we have a BCF too.

A number of people have left legacies in their wills to the BCF; it might as well still be there to collect them.

[Nick Grey]

Anyone of sound mind ought to realise BCF is no more. I understand the point but seems very strange.

[Carl Hibbard]

Those same people have also being causing unrest and disharmony within the Board for many years.

Projection, Chris, projection.

No Justin not projection, just the hard bitten experience of attending ECF Board meetings for 18 months and also viewing and reading the e-mail exchanges between Board members that were often vitriolic and indeed downright abusive and as in one infamous case a clear and serious breach of the ECF Code of Conduct.

You were never elected were you Chris?

[NickFaulks]

just the hard bitten experience of attending ECF Board meetings for 18 months

Wasn't that a bit controversial in itself?

[Chris Fegan]

just the hard bitten experience of attending ECF Board meetings for 18 months

Wasn't that a bit controversial in itself?

Nick

Not in the least.

I was appointed by the Board to give them Strategic Advice both at their meetings and in general day to day activity.

Chris