2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
No country has a blameless history and most not even a blameless present. But the comparison is confusing politics with the suitability of the venue for the players. We would not be having this discussion if the event was in the US.
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
No country has a blameless history/present ... but some are more blameless than others.
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
That is no doubt true. This is the English Chess Forum, and the fact that players from a large number of less important federations could never get visas would be thought of little significance.Paul Cooksey wrote: ↑Sun Nov 12, 2017 12:30 amWe would not be having this discussion if the event was in the US.
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
That would depend on the poster, I would suggestNickFaulks wrote: ↑Sun Nov 12, 2017 9:17 pmThat is no doubt true. This is the English Chess Forum, and the fact that players from a large number of less important federations could never get visas would be thought of little significance.Paul Cooksey wrote: ↑Sun Nov 12, 2017 12:30 amWe would not be having this discussion if the event was in the US.
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
According to FIDE, Nigel is the first to sign up.
http://www.fide.com/component/content/a ... ation.html
That's notwithstanding
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/ ... rand-mufti
Leon Watson in the Telegraph
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/11 ... p-players/
This reveals that Jovanka won't be going.
Leon Watson in Telegraph wrote: England's top female player, Jovanka Houska, told chess.com: "I definitely wouldn’t play in Saudi Arabia. I imagine the event will probably be very well run, so safety probably wouldn’t be an issue."
But she added: "I really don’t feel comfortable visiting a country where I would need to be accompanied by a male guardian.
"It goes against my principles and I am sure my rebellious side would get me into trouble! Fide need to be transparent about how they choose their venues."
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
This is not a team event where all countries should be treated equally, is it? I think it matters how it impacts top players, not the rank and file. I would consider whether a venue acceptable to Russian players is far more important than one acceptable to English players, to clarify.NickFaulks wrote: ↑Sun Nov 12, 2017 9:17 pmThat is no doubt true. This is the English Chess Forum, and the fact that players from a large number of less important federations could never get visas would be thought of little significance.Paul Cooksey wrote: ↑Sun Nov 12, 2017 12:30 amWe would not be having this discussion if the event was in the US.
I'm not actually suggesting FIDE organises a tournament in Crimea, although given their track record probably only a matter of time.
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
I considered that and it is a fair point, although many here would in other circumstances insist that it's the principle of the thing. In any case, how many players on this list would fail to get a US visa, particularly in six weeks? I think a lot. Much has been made here of the suggestion that an Iranian player will be denied entry to Saudi Arabia, which I find strange, given the vast number of Iranians who take part every year in the hajj. But the US, how would you rate his chances?Paul Cooksey wrote: ↑Mon Nov 13, 2017 12:50 pmThis is not a team event where all countries should be treated equally, is it? I think it matters how it impacts top players, not the rank and file.
I am waiting to hear of any invited player who has tried to play and failed. That would be a serious blow to Saudi Arabia's prestige, more than reversing any PR gain they may have made by hosting the event.
By the way, I thought it was quite wrong for England to play in the 1986 Dubai Olympiad, from which Israel was excluded, but I don't remember much fuss about it. Does anyone have a clearer recollection?
As a factual matter, FIDE does not recognise Crimea as part of Russia, which puts any official events in that region out of court.I'm not actually suggesting FIDE organises a tournament in Crimea, although given their track record probably only a matter of time.
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
Indeed a test case would be of great interest to the chess world generally. I believe the PCA is strongly against the tournament. Perhaps its president would consider trying to enter and play and see what happens?NickFaulks wrote: ↑Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:33 pmI am waiting to hear of any invited player who has tried to play and failed. That would be a serious blow to Saudi Arabia's prestige, more than reversing any PR gain they may have made by hosting the event.
Ah, but I was so much older then. I'm younger than that now.
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
Jon Mestel declined selection for England and the Dutch boycotted it. Israel didn't play or even ask to play, but "understood" FIDE's reasons for awarding it to Dubai. Presumably the same reasons as Saudi Arabia, a large budget from which FIDE takes a cut.NickFaulks wrote: ↑Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:33 pm
By the way, I thought it was quite wrong for England to play in the 1986 Dubai Olympiad, from which Israel was excluded, but I don't remember much fuss about it. Does anyone have a clearer recollection?
Which one of the rival FIDE managements made the decision? Saudi isn't a Russian client so maybe not Kirsan.
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
Well before Kirsan's time. Campo would have been in total control.Roger de Coverly wrote: ↑Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:30 pmWhich one of the rival FIDE managements made the decision? Saudi isn't a Russian client so maybe not Kirsan.
edit : it's just dawned on me that your comment referred to the 2017 event - "Saudi" should have been a giveaway.
It's easy to forget the theory of "rival managements", which exists only in your head. There is only one management, and it resides in Athens.
Last edited by NickFaulks on Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
In 1986, but not 2017, as I was referring to the decision to award the Rapid and Blitz events to Saudi Arabia. I was presuming as in 1986, that money for FIDE's coffers was the primary motivation.NickFaulks wrote: ↑Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:44 pmWell before Kirsan's time. Campo would have been in total control.
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
On Twitter, Simon Williams recently posted that he failed to get the right visa to do something chessy in the USA, and so was pointed in the direction of the next flight home. I think David Sedgwick couldn't get a visa for St. Louis one year too.NickFaulks wrote: ↑Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:33 pmIn any case, how many players on this list would fail to get a US visa, particularly in six weeks?
In other sports, Kyle Anderson, an Australian darts player, was unable to get a UK visa for some time, and had to miss various prestigious events while it got sorted. He was ranked in the top 32 at the time. Hossein Vafaei, an Iranian snooker player, couldn't get a visa to play in the International Championship in China. He finally managed it in time to catch the last possible flight to get him to his match in time ... only for the flight to be cancelled at short notice. More comically, there are often a number of Chinese players who can't get visas to play in the China Open, or some other Chinese tournament. Why? World Snooker in its wisdom holds the 1st round of the competition, which it calls "Qualifiers", in somewhere like Barnsley or Preston - and they can't get UK visas.
Which got me thinking. If England hosted this event rather than Saudi Arabia, how many players would fail to get visas? I'm sure some wouldn't.
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
It might well depend on whether the event had some form of official support. There weren't visa problems for the 2012 Olympics for example. For that matter football teams never seem to have a problem.Alex Holowczak wrote: ↑Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:27 amWhich got me thinking. If England hosted this event rather than Saudi Arabia, how many players would fail to get visas? I'm sure some wouldn't.
The London Classic has had problems in the past.
The Armenian team didn't play in Baku, although Aronian played the World Cup there.
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
That was because their own government told them not to go - for political reasons, not for their own safety. The Azeris had made it clear that they hoped they would go.Roger de Coverly wrote: ↑Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:34 amThe Armenian team didn't play in Baku, although Aronian played the World Cup there.
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Re: 2017 King Salman World Rapid and Blitz Chess Championships, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia, 26-30 December 2017
There was a PSG player refused entry to play in a Champions League match in LondonRoger de Coverly wrote: ↑Tue Nov 14, 2017 10:34 amFor that matter football teams never seem to have a problem
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