Tony Miles - the Ultimate Humiliation
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Tony Miles - the Ultimate Humiliation
According to the Olimpbase files (http://www.olimpbase.org/Elo/data/elo1967-2001.zip) Tony Miles FIN was 403385.
Go along to the FIDE Rating site and type it in the search box and you get another player altogether.
Click on "Click to view all previous periods", scroll down to the bottom of the screen and you see entries for July 2001 and October 2001. Click on either of these and you see the ratings calculations for one "Miles, Anthony J." The next entry isn't until January 2007 and is for somebody else entirely.
Tony Miles FIN has been reused! This feels like something on a par with having your grave dug up and somebody else buried there. Shocking that this should be done to England's first grandmaster!
Go along to the FIDE Rating site and type it in the search box and you get another player altogether.
Click on "Click to view all previous periods", scroll down to the bottom of the screen and you see entries for July 2001 and October 2001. Click on either of these and you see the ratings calculations for one "Miles, Anthony J." The next entry isn't until January 2007 and is for somebody else entirely.
Tony Miles FIN has been reused! This feels like something on a par with having your grave dug up and somebody else buried there. Shocking that this should be done to England's first grandmaster!
Ah, but I was so much older then. I'm younger than that now.
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Re: Tony Miles - the Ultimate Humiliation
This was done in the past. By bad luck, I'm told that the practice was stopped in 2007.Brian Towers wrote: ↑Wed Jul 18, 2018 7:32 pmAccording to the Olimpbase files (http://www.olimpbase.org/Elo/data/elo1967-2001.zip) Tony Miles FIN was 403385.
Go along to the FIDE Rating site and type it in the search box and you get another player altogether.
Click on "Click to view all previous periods", scroll down to the bottom of the screen and you see entries for July 2001 and October 2001. Click on either of these and you see the ratings calculations for one "Miles, Anthony J." The next entry isn't until January 2007 and is for somebody else entirely.
Tony Miles FIN has been reused! This feels like something on a par with having your grave dug up and somebody else buried there. Shocking that this should be done to England's first grandmaster!
I'm not sure that I quite share your level of outrage, but I agree that it would have been nicer for his number, and others, to have been retired.
I have searched for others, and have found the Spanish GM David Garcia Ilundain, who died very young in 2002.
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Re: Tony Miles - the Ultimate Humiliation
The reuse of ids is also (in this case at least) poor systems design and should have been properly corrected.Brian Towers wrote: ↑Wed Jul 18, 2018 7:32 pmTony Miles FIN has been reused! This feels like something on a par with having your grave dug up and somebody else buried there. Shocking that this should be done to England's first grandmaster!
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Re: Tony Miles - the Ultimate Humiliation
I imagine that changing the FIDs of players who have reused numbers would be difficult and would in any case create more problems than it solved. The 2007 decision to stop this practice was certainly a good one.
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Re: Tony Miles - the Ultimate Humiliation
Like at least one other on the Forum, I was at school with Tony (I was in the year above). I was hugely impressed by his achievements, stunned by his sidestep when we played in the same rugby team and saddened by his demise; I treasure his memory. However, unfortunate (and unnecessary) though this may seem, I don't think it's highly significant.
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Re: Tony Miles - the Ultimate Humiliation
Interestingly, Miles's FIN was reused for an older player. That can't have happened too many times.
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Re: Tony Miles - the Ultimate Humiliation
I don't think whoever is maintaining the FIDE rating database has anybody remotely resembling a database expert. It is full of "dirty data".Angus French wrote: ↑Wed Jul 18, 2018 9:54 pmThe reuse of ids is also (in this case at least) poor systems design and should have been properly corrected.
Check out the years of birth of these players, some of whom must have escaped from the Highlander set .
FINs of the ancients -
11506946
10003983
3945669
2938316
3004236
9012435
8504687
30937175
30937540
54510902
30932548
21600376
73012114
1466801
30946263
11505761
3827852
1455648
6603343
4704118
1453475
1658344
Some of these are from Online Arena, which is a reflection of the standard of that interface, some are from federations which you could imagine not being particularly professional, but many are from "proper" federations (US and Western European) for players with proper ratings.
One of them (3827852) even has a title (School Instructor) and a picture. He looks really good for someone who is over 1000 years old.
Clearly there are problems at both the individual federation level and the FIDE level.
Ah, but I was so much older then. I'm younger than that now.
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Re: Tony Miles - the Ultimate Humiliation
I shall look into this. However, your assumption that US and Western European federations are "proper ones" which might be expected to do things correctly is highly revealing and quite wrong.Brian Towers wrote: ↑Sun Jul 22, 2018 11:48 amsome are from federations which you could imagine not being particularly professional, but many are from "proper" federations (US and Western European)
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Re: Tony Miles - the Ultimate Humiliation
Federations from chess developing countries may need a certain amount of support, but otherwise it is surely not unreasonable to expect that all Federations try and do things correctly.NickFaulks wrote: ↑Mon Jul 23, 2018 9:39 amHowever, your assumption that US and Western European federations are "proper ones" which might be expected to do things correctly is highly revealing and quite wrong.
All too often that is not the case, of course.
A few years ago the Federation which was hosting the European Individual Championship had no compunction about assembling a team of arbiters the majority of whom had failed to apply and pay for their FIDE Arbiters' Licences.
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Re: Tony Miles - the Ultimate Humiliation
I think you fail to understand the use of scare quotes around "proper". With the USA leading the way on 4 ancients and Denmark second on 3, so called "proper" federations are clearly anything but. Not that their lack of competence excuses FIDE's failure to do basic checks on data coming into its system.NickFaulks wrote: ↑Mon Jul 23, 2018 9:39 amHowever, your assumption that US and Western European federations are "proper ones" which might be expected to do things correctly is highly revealing and quite wrong.Brian Towers wrote: ↑Sun Jul 22, 2018 11:48 amsome are from federations which you could imagine not being particularly professional, but many are from "proper" federations (US and Western European)
Ah, but I was so much older then. I'm younger than that now.
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Re: Tony Miles - the Ultimate Humiliation
Credit where credit is due, all but one of these have been fixed by removing the date year. The one remaining is Brina Jelen (FID), born in "0205".NickFaulks wrote: ↑Mon Jul 23, 2018 9:39 amI shall look into this.Brian Towers wrote: ↑Sun Jul 22, 2018 11:48 amsome are from federations which you could imagine not being particularly professional, but many are from "proper" federations (US and Western European)
However one new anomaly has been introduced, a "No-Name" from Thailand with FIN 6210090. Somebody called "Aden O'Shea" appeared with this FIN in the July and August lists. The name has been blanked out in the latest September list.
Ah, but I was so much older then. I'm younger than that now.
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Re: Tony Miles - the Ultimate Humiliation
Would ENG be one of the above federations or has it stalled in its development ?David Sedgwick wrote: ↑Mon Jul 23, 2018 10:56 amFederations from chess developing countries may need a certain amount of support, but otherwise it is surely not unreasonable to expect that all Federations try and do things correctly.
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