Cheating in chess
-
- Posts: 3600
- Joined: Fri May 16, 2008 11:54 am
Re: Cheating in chess
Looks a pretty average game to me
https://lichess.org/gX1cn9VK#113
Doesn't look like a super GM cheating
(you have to remember it is 3 0, but still)
https://lichess.org/gX1cn9VK#113
Doesn't look like a super GM cheating
(you have to remember it is 3 0, but still)
-
- Posts: 3600
- Joined: Fri May 16, 2008 11:54 am
Re: Cheating in chess
Having played through all Maghsoodloo's games at the Levitov Cup, I would say this
1. The case against him seems to based on him playing better than expected for a player of his rating and only making mistakes when he is in an 'overwhelming' position
2. I don't know how often super GMs make mistakes in 3 0 chess, so I don't know how outstanding the performing is
3. I would be doubtful that the case would pass the legal threshold of beyond reasonable doubt (in a criminal case)
When considering the case one has to consider the mechanism by which a player would cheat in 3 0 chess
The player who finished 8th (GM Uzbek005) has also had their account closed.
1. The case against him seems to based on him playing better than expected for a player of his rating and only making mistakes when he is in an 'overwhelming' position
2. I don't know how often super GMs make mistakes in 3 0 chess, so I don't know how outstanding the performing is
3. I would be doubtful that the case would pass the legal threshold of beyond reasonable doubt (in a criminal case)
When considering the case one has to consider the mechanism by which a player would cheat in 3 0 chess
The player who finished 8th (GM Uzbek005) has also had their account closed.
-
- Posts: 8452
- Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:28 pm
Re: Cheating in chess
For a player of his rating? He is one of the best blitz players in the world.Matthew Turner wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:21 pm1. The case against him seems to based on him playing better than expected for a player of his rating
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a QR code stamped on a human face — forever.
-
- Posts: 3600
- Joined: Fri May 16, 2008 11:54 am
Re: Cheating in chess
Yes, I know.NickFaulks wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:22 pmFor a player of his rating? He is one of the best blitz players in the world.Matthew Turner wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:21 pm1. The case against him seems to based on him playing better than expected for a player of his rating
-
- Posts: 21291
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 2:51 pm
Re: Cheating in chess
The server itself might facilitate this. If there's real time coverage with analysis and suggestions, a player could log in as a spectator and take hints from the commentary. But are lichess claiming that the computer was configured so that the engine was automatically playing all the moves?Matthew Turner wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:21 pmWhen considering the case one has to consider the mechanism by which a player would cheat in 3 0 chess
-
- Posts: 3600
- Joined: Fri May 16, 2008 11:54 am
Re: Cheating in chess
No and No.Roger de Coverly wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:42 pmThe server itself might facilitate this. If there's real time coverage with analysis and suggestions, a player could log in as a spectator and take hints from the commentary. But are lichess claiming that the computer was configured so that the engine was automatically playing all the moves?Matthew Turner wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:21 pmWhen considering the case one has to consider the mechanism by which a player would cheat in 3 0 chess
-
- Posts: 8452
- Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:28 pm
Re: Cheating in chess
But do they? I wonder what they are using, is that one of the things they don't reveal?
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a QR code stamped on a human face — forever.
-
- Posts: 3600
- Joined: Fri May 16, 2008 11:54 am
Re: Cheating in chess
Yes they do - all titled player accounts are verified.NickFaulks wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 4:18 pmBut do they? I wonder what they are using, is that one of the things they don't reveal?
-
- Posts: 8452
- Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:28 pm
Re: Cheating in chess
So what rating do you think they are using?Matthew Turner wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 4:23 pmYes they do - all titled player accounts are verified.
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a QR code stamped on a human face — forever.
-
- Posts: 3600
- Joined: Fri May 16, 2008 11:54 am
Re: Cheating in chess
Those making the decision to close Maghsoodloo's account would be aware of all the ratings (online and OTB) that the player holds.NickFaulks wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 4:30 pmSo what rating do you think they are using?Matthew Turner wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 4:23 pmYes they do - all titled player accounts are verified.
Any thoughts on the games?
-
- Posts: 8452
- Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:28 pm
Re: Cheating in chess
No, I don't do that.
I wish you didn't have to keep relying on things that platforms "would be aware of". If they are comparing quality of play to a rating, why can they not reveal the rating they have in mind? The usual story is that if they revealed details of their methods it would assist cheaters, but I don't see how this would.
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a QR code stamped on a human face — forever.
-
- Posts: 175
- Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2009 3:32 pm
Re: Cheating in chess
Nick,NickFaulks wrote: ↑Wed Dec 30, 2020 6:03 pmNo, I don't do that.
I wish you didn't have to keep relying on things that platforms "would be aware of". If they are comparing quality of play to a rating, why can they not reveal the rating they have in mind? The usual story is that if they revealed details of their methods it would assist cheaters, but I don't see how this would.
It is kind of a circular answer i'm afraid. Lets use a completely stupid example to illustrate. If everyone that cheated OTB wore blue t-shirts and the arbiters knew that, they would pay more attention to people who wore blue t shirts. The cheaters would soon learn that is how they are being detected and switch to red.
Ok that is a very simplistic way to look at it but it is similar to cheating detection methods. I don't reveal to people about the electronic methods I use in tournaments for working out if someone has a phone or electronic device. Everyone can see me with a hand scanner but they don't know what else I am doing. As the FIDE Press officer can vouch from the Grand Swiss, they work really well. If the cheats knew how I was doing it, they can modify behaviours to stop me detecting meaning I have to develop more methods...
-
- Posts: 8452
- Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:28 pm
Re: Cheating in chess
Andy,Andy Howie wrote: ↑Thu Dec 31, 2020 8:40 pmIf the cheats knew how I was doing it, they can modify behaviours to stop me detecting meaning I have to develop more methods...
Yes I do get that, at least in a limited way, but not here. I wonder whether the platform is saying that Parham is playing online blitz as well as Carlsen, to which he would reply "what's your point?".
If you want a picture of the future, imagine a QR code stamped on a human face — forever.
-
- Posts: 3600
- Joined: Fri May 16, 2008 11:54 am
Re: Cheating in chess
I believe if Carlsen had performed in the same way as Maghsoodloo he would have had his account closed.NickFaulks wrote: ↑Fri Jan 01, 2021 12:50 pmAndy,Andy Howie wrote: ↑Thu Dec 31, 2020 8:40 pmIf the cheats knew how I was doing it, they can modify behaviours to stop me detecting meaning I have to develop more methods...
Yes I do get that, at least in a limited way, but not here. I wonder whether the platform is saying that Parham is playing online blitz as well as Carlsen, to which he would reply "what's your point?".
-
- Posts: 3484
- Joined: Mon Jul 06, 2009 1:36 pm
- Location: Under Cover
- Contact:
Re: Cheating in chess
" Everyone can see me with a hand scanner but they don't know what else I am doing."
Why am I suddenly reminded of BBC License fee detector vans which detected nothing
but cruised about pretending they could catch non-license fee payers.
Why am I suddenly reminded of BBC License fee detector vans which detected nothing
but cruised about pretending they could catch non-license fee payers.