What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
andrew martin

Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by andrew martin » Mon Jan 05, 2009 11:03 am

Firstly, greetings from Kansas City Missouri ( good pub quiz question) where it's 5am and therefore this question might be a bit rough around the edges:)


Looking at the thread, one thing jumps out.

Charles,you obviously had a unique set of skills the person or people that appointed you saw necessary and that maybe the Renaissance Academy had the unique materials ready to accompany the sets into schools.

Do you know whether your appointment was in fact debated and decided upon by the ECF board?

Best, Andrew

andrew martin

Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by andrew martin » Mon Jan 05, 2009 12:09 pm

One more thing, addressed to Charles:

Was any arrangement ever made between the ECF or any official of the ECF and yourself whether off the record or on, so that in return for all your hard work, the Renaissance Academy would have first rights to introduce coaching materials into schools ?

I think the answer to this question would clarify things for a lot of people.

Let me say I would have never had a problem with that, given the amount of work that appeared at your door.

I'd like to go on record that I support professionals making money from chess in England 100% and I am keen to help them if I can.

Andrew

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Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by Mike Gunn » Mon Jan 05, 2009 1:14 pm

If you look at the ECF articles and bye laws (http://www.englishchess.org.uk/organisa ... _apr07.htm) you will see that it would be in order for the board to delegate its powers (including the power to appoint an officer) to a committee containing at least one board member as long as it reports its exercise of such powers to the board in a timely fashion. The full board can then overturn (or ratify) decisions/actions carried out by the committee.

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Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by Charles W. Wood » Mon Jan 05, 2009 2:39 pm

andrew martin wrote:One more thing, addressed to Charles:

Was any arrangement ever made between the ECF or any official of the ECF and yourself whether off the record or on, so that in return for all your hard work, the Renaissance Academy would have first rights to introduce coaching materials into schools ?

I think the answer to this question would clarify things for a lot of people.

Let me say I would have never had a problem with that, given the amount of work that appeared at your door.

I'd like to go on record that I support professionals making money from chess in England 100% and I am keen to help them if I can.

Andrew
Great question and one that should have been answered long ago. The Coaching materials that the Renaissance Academy sent out were not ready but as the CfS Project needed something I (and I do mean I) just got on with the job. No one from the ECF had any involvement on that front. The Renaissance Academy Certification Programme was withdrawn the minute Andrew was brought on board.

At some point I will be need to get in touch with you.
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Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by Charles W. Wood » Mon Jan 05, 2009 3:12 pm

andrew martin wrote: Do you know whether your appointment was in fact debated and decided upon by the ECF board?

Best, Andrew
Hi Andrew

A short but straight answer: I have no idea.

USA Eh, I bet its not snowing near you. :cry:
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Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by Peter Sowray » Mon Jan 05, 2009 4:23 pm

I'm not entirely sure that it's worth raking over the past in this fashion ... surely it's better to move forward.

But since it's exercising a number of you, Charles Wood's appointment to CfS was decided at an ECF Board meeting on March 8th last year. This was a face-to-face meeting (rather than a conference call) and as I recall all the Board members were present except for Martin Regan, whose train south did not make it past Crewe. Martin took part in some of the meeting by phone. Cynthia Gurney was also present.

Charles had submitted quite a lengthy paper describing his approach to the CfS project. In my view, there was much of merit in this paper, but there were also some legitimate questions that Board members had. It was a shame that Charles was not present at the meeting ... but as I recall Gerry said he had not been available.

The discussion about the CfS project lasted about an hour. There was a brief debate about the role of the Renaissance Academy. My view was, and still is, that it would have been quite appropriate for Charles to be financially rewarded if the project was successful. However Charles's paper was not clear on how this would work.

The main issues discussed were the logisitics of how the sets were to be delivered to schools and the resources, both human and financial, that would be required to make the project a success. I believe that several Board members recognised at that time that CfS was a very substantial and risky project.

I am sorry that CfS turned out in the way it did. Charles, Andrew and others may have grievances about how the ECF treated them, but it is not right to say that the ECF Board never gave the matter serious consideration.

I hope this helps.

Peter

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Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by Charles W. Wood » Mon Jan 05, 2009 5:25 pm

Peter Sowray wrote:I'm not entirely sure that it's worth raking over the past in this fashion ... surely it's better to move forward.

But since it's exercising a number of you, Charles Wood's appointment to CfS was decided at an ECF Board meeting on March 8th last year. This was a face-to-face meeting (rather than a conference call) and as I recall all the Board members were present except for Martin Regan, whose train south did not make it past Crewe. Martin took part in some of the meeting by phone. Cynthia Gurney was also present.

Charles had submitted quite a lengthy paper describing his approach to the CfS project. In my view, there was much of merit in this paper, but there were also some legitimate questions that Board members had. It was a shame that Charles was not present at the meeting ... but as I recall Gerry said he had not been available.

The discussion about the CfS project lasted about an hour. There was a brief debate about the role of the Renaissance Academy. My view was, and still is, that it would have been quite appropriate for Charles to be financially rewarded if the project was successful. However Charles's paper was not clear on how this would work.

The main issues discussed were the logisitics of how the sets were to be delivered to schools and the resources, both human and financial, that would be required to make the project a success. I believe that several Board members recognised at that time that CfS was a very substantial and risky project.

I am sorry that CfS turned out in the way it did. Charles, Andrew and others may have grievances about how the ECF treated them, but it is not right to say that the ECF Board never gave the matter serious consideration.

I hope this helps.

Peter
Sounds about right, but if I remember rightly there was a discussion about whether or not I should be there and it was decided that I didn't need to be. But apart from that it looks OK. However I was using the title before that, but that will have been unofficially I guess. I didn't sign a contract until June though.

I like the financial reward bit (joking) I knew when I took this project on it was going to cost me and I don't have the heart to take any money from the ECF. I did get treated just fine after June 2008 so no grievance there. I think it would be fair to say the then ECF gave it consideration but not quite serious consideration.
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Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by Matthew Turner » Mon Jan 05, 2009 6:03 pm

Charles W Wood wrote:
Great question and one that should have been answered long ago. The Coaching materials that the Renaissance Academy sent out were not ready but as the CfS Project needed something I (and I do mean I) just got on with the job. No one from the ECF had any involvement on that front. The Renaissance Academy Certification Programme was withdrawn the minute Andrew was brought on board.

I have three points to make
1. What was the urgency in sending out coaching materials, after all, there were not, and still are not, any chess sets?
2. It is not right to imply that the Renaissance Academy materials were the only ones available. There is loads of coaching material available on the Internet, such as the (free) chesskids.com
3. If the Renaissance Academy programme was withdrawn when Andrew Martin was brought on board, wouldn't it have saved time and effort if Charles had spoken to Andrew as soon as he took up his post.

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Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by Charles W. Wood » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:22 pm

Martin Regan wrote:
The Renaissance Academy Certification Programme was withdrawn the minute Andrew was brought on board.
Er....not quite accurate that, is it Charles?

Of course, you could easily have forgotten the two-hour phone conversation we had when I told you that unless you stopped insisting that you had the support of Holloid and that the "academy" materials were the only ones that would go into the school then I would immediately withdraw the ECF from the scheme and schedule a press conference to explain why.

These things do slip one's mind sometimes. :roll:
Ah yes I remember this conversation your dead right. This is the one where you wouldn't explain why Andrew was not on board. And the description as you use it "the "academy" materials were the only ones that would go into the school" the would part should be could. As the DfE meeting had revealed some changes were needed in the ECF Cert of Excellence scheme hence the reason it was withdrawn the minute Andrew was brought in. And forgetting completely that Holloid was very frustrated with the lack of action from .. well you.

It did conveniently did slip your mind.
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Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by Richard James » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:26 pm

Perhaps I may be permitted to explain what was supposed to be my part in the Chess for Schools project. By the way, Matthew, many thanks for your continued kind remarks about chessKIDS academy.

On 18 December 2006 I had a meeting with Robert Richmond, at which the following was agreed (as per email from Robert to me, copied to Martin Regan, Claire Summerscale and Andrew Martin):

ECF would wish to acquire rights to chessKIDS. There are potentially 4 uses to be made, each of which would attract a royalty.
1. As part of a standard package to schools
2. As a benefit of ECF Junior membership
3. Book form, both as part of the package to schools and for sale through commercial outlets
4. CD form for sale through commercial outlets, with the addition of a weak computer program

This was to be part of a package for schools to be piloted in September 2007 and going live nationally in September 2008.

I heard no more about this until last June when I had another meeting with Robert.

I left that meeting with the understanding, possibly mistaken, that I was to write a book for children based on the first part of chessKIDS and also linking up chess to the rest of the curriculum. Schools would be encouraged to buy multiple copies to distribute to all their chess pupils and I would receive a royalty of £1 for each copy sold. I was also asked to produce a mock-up of an online Certificate of Merit/Excellence test and we also discussed producing some sort of DVD as part of the package.

We continued to discuss this and, in early August, I was told I would receive a contract once the details had been confirmed with David Anderton. I heard nothing for a few weeks and enquiries as to when I would receive the contract met with no reply, so I stopped working on the book.

A couple of months later, as a result of postings on this forum, I spoke to John Upham and Andrew Martin. It transpired that Andrew and his team had been asked to do something very similar to what I had been asked to do, and it seemed that Matthew Turner was still working on developing the current ECF Certificate of Excellence.

Andrew asked me to continue my book as a book for schools, but with a royalty which would be many times lower that that which I had been led to expect by Robert.

As you might imagine, I'm not very happy with what has happened and the way I've been treated over the past two years. However, I have nothing personal against anyone who has been involved with the project in any way over that period. It seems to me that the problems have arisen as a result of mismanagement at the top.

I am still interested in developing chessKIDS as a professional product and am always happy to speak to anyone who is not going to mess me around or waste my time.

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Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by Charles W. Wood » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:40 pm

Matthew Turner wrote:Charles W Wood wrote:
Great question and one that should have been answered long ago. The Coaching materials that the Renaissance Academy sent out were not ready but as the CfS Project needed something I (and I do mean I) just got on with the job. No one from the ECF had any involvement on that front. The Renaissance Academy Certification Programme was withdrawn the minute Andrew was brought on board.

I have three points to make
1. What was the urgency in sending out coaching materials, after all, there were not, and still are not, any chess sets?
2. It is not right to imply that the Renaissance Academy materials were the only ones available. There is loads of coaching material available on the Internet, such as the (free) chesskids.com
3. If the Renaissance Academy programme was withdrawn when Andrew Martin was brought on board, wouldn't it have saved time and effort if Charles had spoken to Andrew as soon as he took up his post.
Answer:

1. the plan was to start production earlier, in fact way before the six week hols. Not being able to get the last haulier in place slowed that down. Oil prices then ground it to a holt. Then the finding of a faulty tool has lead to this delay.
2. The coaching part was not the problem, testing was. If we are dealing with schools in the way we do now the DoE would not be interested in getting involved in how things work (thats down to the individual school) but if we are dealing with, at the time, all schools the DoE would check everything we had. They wanted to lose the multichoice testing and have 50% of the course as vocational/interactive development. I couldn't find anything out there but I did check out as many as I could get my hands on and took 3 to Caxton House and pre sent 6 others.
3. This ones harder, I wanted Andrew from day one but as I was working on so much I couldn't get hold of him direct. I was also Marketing Dept and him Junior & Education part of the ECF, so I was a bit cagey about inviting him on board (That is definitely my fault as I didn't understand ECF politics and assumed it would work like a normal organisation). So I turned to the board.
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Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by Richard James » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:50 pm

Charles W. Wood wrote:Charles W Wood wrote:

2. The coaching part was not the problem, testing was. If we are dealing with schools in the way we do now the DoE would not be interested in getting involved in how things work (thats down to the individual school) but if we are dealing with, at the time, all schools the DoE would check everything we had. They wanted to lose the multichoice testing and have 50% of the course as vocational/interactive development. I couldn't find anything out there but I did check out as many as I could get my hands on and took 3 to Caxton House and pre sent 6 others.
Charles - quick question.

Did the DCSF (as we now have to call it) see the Certificate of Excellence as something aimed mainly at Primary Schools or Secondary Schools? Or both?

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Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by Charles W. Wood » Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:57 pm

Richard James wrote:
Charles W. Wood wrote:Charles W Wood wrote:

2. The coaching part was not the problem, testing was. If we are dealing with schools in the way we do now the DoE would not be interested in getting involved in how things work (thats down to the individual school) but if we are dealing with, at the time, all schools the DoE would check everything we had. They wanted to lose the multichoice testing and have 50% of the course as vocational/interactive development. I couldn't find anything out there but I did check out as many as I could get my hands on and took 3 to Caxton House and pre sent 6 others.
Charles - quick question.

Did the DCSF (as we now have to call it) see the Certificate of Excellence as something aimed mainly at Primary Schools or Secondary Schools? Or both?
I hate the initials DCSF as I can never get them in the right order, but you are right and I should use them. To your question: it was never made that specific and in such I understood they were looking at all the Programmes as Both. Especially as this was about Chess for all Schools.
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Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by Matthew Turner » Mon Jan 05, 2009 11:00 pm

Martin Regan wrote (to Charles W Wood)
Of course, you could easily have forgotten the two-hour phone conversation we had when I told you that unless you stopped insisting that you had the support of Holloid and that the "academy" materials were the only ones that would go into the school then I would immediately withdraw the ECF from the scheme and schedule a press conference to explain why.

Can this really be true? Did you really have the power to withdraw the ECF from the CfS project? If you did, wouldn't it be simpler to just replace Charles W Wood?

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Re: What did Martin Regan Do?????????????

Post by Charles W. Wood » Mon Jan 05, 2009 11:06 pm

Ernie Lazenby wrote:Charles would you be so kind as to answer this question I posted earlier tonight;

Charles while you are being candid would you mind saying what you think now of the timing of the high profile pres release by Gerry with the two MP's.

Given that nothing had actually been started it seems to me it was way to early?

Your thoughts would be appreciated.Ernie Lazenby

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What I think was and is of no use. I had no opinion. It was inevitable that it would happen right from the 17th Dec 07, as soon as Michael Foster MP wrote to all the MP's across England asking them to contact schools to get them involved a PR campaign was going to be on the cards, two very big reasons:
1. MP's were putting on there websites so the wider chess community was going to find out anyway.
2. Because MP's are great at self promotion. It is their nature.

Was the idea of the letters going to MP's right? At that point in time I think is was a good call on the information Gerry and Peter had at the time. It may look hasty now but thats only with hind sight.
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