Should Andrew Paulson resign as ECF President?

[Sean Hewitt]

Phil Ehr chaired the meeting and at the outset suggested that instead of item 1, each Director articulate their issues / views in turn. The meeting agreed this suggestion (unanimously as I recall; certainly nem com) and thus that is what happened.

Sean, can you point to where in the draft minutes this is stated? I can't see it.

The thing about a draft is that it is, errrm, a draft. Even when finalised, it is not a verbatim record of the meeting.

[Martin Crichton]

It could be argued here that this poll is more reflective / accurate than the recent voting by the directors at the EGM as I for one find it bizzare that so many directors abstained when voting in the no confidence motion in the case of NS and so overwhelmingly for in the case of AP.
One could argue that several of the directors were playing boardroom politics when abstaining in the case of NS. As directors I think they have a duty to express their views one way or the other rather than sitting on the fence.

[John McKenna]

HE HAS!!
According to the ECF website and posters in other threads.
So the 'Cinderella Man'(*) - the great American white hope of English chess - is knocked out of the English ring by the Black Prince. Rumour has it that Andrew P will fight for a European title with ECF support!? Maybe there will be no losers in this unbelievable knock about.

*NB: James J. Braddock's last fight was a win over Englishman Tommy Farr - but he had home advantage, I believe.

[Colm Daly]

Well, when I had wrote my own little piece about his options.
http://www.ecforum.org.uk/viewtopic.php ... 00#p132680
I got one thing wrong

I had ended my little piece asking the wrong question.

"How about if Andrew Paulson goes for the position of Fide president?"

Of course what I should asked was how about if Andrew Paulson goes for the position of deputy ECU president.
Silly me.

[John McKenna]

Colm Daly>Of course what I should asked was how about if Andrew Paulson goes for the position of deputy ECU president.
Silly me.<

You're not the only one.
When you got involved how were you to know that you were on the ship of fools?

[PeterFarr]

HE HAS!!
According to the ECF website and posters in other threads.
So the 'Cinderella Man'(*) - the great American white hope of English chess - is knocked out of the English ring by the Black Prince. Rumour has it that Andrew P will fight for a European title with ECF support!? Maybe there will be no losers in this unbelievable knock about.

*NB: James J. Braddock's last fight was a win over Englishman Tommy Farr - but he had home advantage, I believe.

John,

Tommy Farr was actually from South Wales, but his parents were Irish (his father had been a bare-knuckle fighter). He ran a pub in Brighton after his retirement from the boxing ring, and lived the rest of his life in Sussex. His most famous fight was a very close points defeat by Joe Louis in 1937. One of the greatest boxers from these islands.

[Colm Daly]

ship of fools?

Ah yes that brings me back.
http://youtu.be/uRBTM95fjoQ

Been on lots of ships in my time [mostly on route to England or Europe when I was younger] never any shortage of fools. Even though we tell ourselves that we won't get fooled again

http://youtu.be/SHhrZgojY1Q

But at the end of the day we are all just like the fool on the hill.

http://youtu.be/UNfS9Ywb2Cc

Meanwhile Mr Pleasant goes about his business as usual.

http://youtu.be/WKmRr2cGrP8

Perhaps it is true to say that the great mass are simply Living on a thin line?

http://youtu.be/CsLhNxzwK1Y

All the stories have been told
Of kings and days of old,
But there's no England now.
All the wars that were won and lost
Somehow don't seem to matter very much anymore.
All the lies we were told,
All the lies of the people running round,
They're castles have burned.
Now I see change,
But inside we're the same as we ever were.

Living on a thin line,
Tell me now, what are we supposed to do?
Living on a thin line,
Tell me now, what are we supposed to do?
Living on a thin line,
Living this way, each day is a dream.
What am I, what are we supposed to do?
Living on a thin line,
Tell me now, what are we supposed to do?

Now another century nearly gone,
What are we gonna leave for the young?
What we couldn't do, what we wouldn't do,
It's a crime, but does it matter?
Does it matter much, does it matter much to you?
Does it ever really matter?
Yes, it really, really matters.

Living on a thin line,
Tell me now, what are we supposed to do?
Living on a thin line,
Tell me now, what are we supposed to do?

Now another leader says
Break their hearts and break some heads.
Is there nothing we can say or do?
Blame the future on the past,
Always lost in blood and guts.
And when they're gone, it's me and you.

Living on a thin line,
Tell me now, what are we supposed to do?
Living on a thin line,
Tell me now, what are we supposed to do?
Living on a thin line.

[Nigel Short]

Andrew Paulson will not be running for ECU Deputy President with my support. I would strongly advise Council to vote against the motion giving AP the proxy - which would not only undermine my authority, but would obviously constitute a vote for Azmai (and also indirectly Kirsan).

[Carl Hibbard]

Andrew Paulson will not be running for ECU Deputy President with my support. I would strongly advise Council to vote against the motion giving AP the proxy - which would not only undermine my authority, but would obviously constitute a vote for Azmai (and also indirectly Kirsan).

So against the board clearly?

[Nigel Short]

Andrew Paulson will not be running for ECU Deputy President with my support. I would strongly advise Council to vote against the motion giving AP the proxy - which would not only undermine my authority, but would obviously constitute a vote for Azmai (and also indirectly Kirsan).

So against the board clearly?

Correct.

[John McKenna]

Nigel has played 'the man'.
Next he will play against the boardmen.
Will he have the confidence of the Councilmen, though?
(Of course, if this is a genuine stitch up sufficient votes will already be promised to be in the bag.)

[John McKenna]

HE HAS!!
...
*NB: James J. Braddock's last fight was a win over Englishman Tommy Farr - but he had home advantage, I believe.

John,

Tommy Farr was actually from South Wales, but his parents were Irish (his father had been a bare-knuckle fighter). He ran a pub in Brighton after his retirement from the boxing ring, and lived the rest of his life in Sussex. His most famous fight was a very close points defeat by Joe Louis in 1937. One of the greatest boxers from these islands.

Thanks, PeterFarr, for the correction.
Tommy Farr was a Welshman of Irish parentage then.
(I originally wrote "Englishman Don Cockell" then changed the name but clean forgot the nationality.)

Tommy Farr - any relation, Peter?

Colm Daly>Been on lots of ships in my time...<

Thanks Colm, for those golden oldies, this one was before your time -

On the Fourth of July 1806 we set sail from the sweet cove of Cork
We were sailing away with a cargo of bricks for the grand City Hall in New York
'twas a wonderful craft, she was rigged for and aft and oh, how the wild wind drove her
She stood several blasts, she had twenty-seven masts and they called her the Irish Rover

We had one million bags of the best Sligo rags, we had two million barrels of stone
We had three million sides of old blind horses hides, we had four million barrels of bones
We had five million hogs, and six million dogs, seven million barrels of porter
We had eight million bails of old nanny-goats' tails in the hold of the Irish Rover

There was awl Mickey Coote who played hard on his flute when the ladies lined up for a set
He was tootlin' with skill for each sparkling quadrille, though the dancers were fluther'd and bet
With his smart witty talk, he was cock of the walk and he rolled the dames under and over
They all knew at a glance when he took up his stance that he sailed in the Irish Rover

There was Barney McGee from the banks of the Lee, there was Hogan from County Tyrone
There was Johnny McGurk who was scared stiff of work and a man from Westmeath called Malone
There was Slugger O'Toole who was drunk as a rule and Fighting Bill Treacy from Dover
And your man, Mike McCann from the banks of the Bann was the skipper on the Irish Rover

For a sailor it`s a bother of life, it`s so lonesome by night and by day
When he longs for the shore and a charming young noor who will melt all his troubles away
All the noise and the rout swillin` poitin and stout, for him soon is done and over
Of the love of a maid he is never afraid, that ould salt from the Irish rover

We had sailed seven years when the measles broke out and the ship lost it's way in the fog
And that whale of a crew was reduced down to two, just meself and the Captain's old dog
Then the ship struck a rock, Oh Lord! what a shock, the bulkhead was turned right over
Turned nine times around and the poor old dog was drowned, I`m the last of the Irish Rover

[PeterFarr]

Tommy Farr - any relation, Peter?

No, but there were no other famous Farr's, so he was a family hero anyway.

I always liked The Pogues' version of The Irish Rover; played with more gusto than accuracy.

[Colm Daly]

Agree that The Pogues [with The Dubliner's] version is fantastic http://youtu.be/au30c9ZMIPg

However my references to those oldies was some of the subliminal messages contained. One can pick and choose from the lyrics many fitting and analogous sentiments that could easily relate to the farce that is this whole Andrew Paulson Pantomine

Starting with Ship of Fools, which is of course by the great American group, The Doors - An American band of immense talent, and energy. A brash band headed up by a cultured but ultimately tragic artistic figure.

Perhaps Ship Of Fools could be an oblique reference to, well, the ECF board of directors, though I am not saying that would be fair myself , just a notion in the air that could at least be played with and entertained.

Then all the rest are among the very best of English pop/rock culture and quintessential English artists.

Won't Get Fooled Again - The Who - Which might have been a question asked of Andrew Paulson, because up until fairly recently I would guess many chess players would be asking Andrew who? While the title should be a clue as to the true state of affairs as the drama unfolded. Though it seems perhaps it should be changed to "Will Get Fooled Again!"

The Fool On The Hill - The Beatles- The essence of English musical brilliance which underscore the sheer genius, inspiration and creativity that can be drawn upon time and time again. An example of the heights to which this creativity can take English chess being perhaps best embodied by Nigel Short's rising to the very pinnacle of world chess after defeating the great Karpov. To then challenge that bloke who wants now, 20 years later, to be the Fide president. True Nigel Short lost that final battle to Garry The Great, but consider some of the chess gems left over for us and future generations to relish and enjoy forever, not to mention the boost this gave to English chess (and further a field- I can recall a distinct spike in interest in chess here in Ireland around 93), for a period of time anyway.

Perhaps in a metaphoric sense Nigel Short could, within the context of the current drama, be seen as The Fool On The Hill. Seeing, knowing, understanding so much more than those who are more preoccupied with the personality politics, ego issues and behind the scenes vested interests of people who really are not all that interested in chess, as in the game of chess. The latest twist arguably sees a national chess hero treated shamefully and disrespected in such a way as to actually only draw attention back on the very real shortcomings of people unable or unwilling to take a principled stand and stand by their man.

Even assuming for the moment that Nigel Short was/is the devil incarnate and somebody that was disliked within certain sections of English chess for any number of reasons, of which, some may, or may not be valid, can it really be said that he has not been cogent, coherent and even wise in the points of view he has expressed?

Has he not been something of a major asset to the ECF, or is he a fool to have given so much of his time and energy trying to deal with issues and being so active as a Fide delegate of the ECF. One assumes that some of his vast experience, knowledge of many different aspects of international chess and chess within England would be a fountain from which to draw upon, to the benefit of the ECF, even when and where some of his ideas and views may not always be correct or the most popular. In other words, he may get things wrong like anyone else, but there can be no denying that he is particularly well informed and involved so as to be taken seriously.

I have actually heard it said that, "oh Nigel Short is a pompous twit" [who isn't at times], but this is often a feature of the situation in which people have never met or talked with a figure, and they simply do not know the person behind whatever public facade is on show. Often such a figure who has gained a degree of notoriety by virtue of expressing forthright views and opinions, perhaps even sometimes unwisely, simply becomes the target of cranks and "haters" who often have little or no idea about what they are writing or talking about. Within the context of Ireland and Irish chess and being a big fish in a small pond myself I have experienced this first hand- in all it's ignorance, dishonesty, stupidity and malice, so it is rather amusing to see this play out on a much higher level and in a far more complex and substantial chess community.

Previously I think it was posted here on this website about character assassination and that too is a regular feature in which we see, what might be called, the revenge of the crap chess player in action. Nigel Short or Kasparov will be told how great they are as chess players [as if they needed reminding of this or the assurance of such from, well, in relative terms, crap chess players! Then again we have to be fair too in admitting that given that all things are relative, you do not need to be able to paint a Mona Lisa or for that matter play a good or great game of chess to be able to appreciate the brilliance.] But that if only they would stay out of chess politics etc etc They would be too dominant etc etc.

Valid arguments to a point, but then the crap chess player steps in! The guy who could never hope to compete with or against the real chess player or in these cases, giants of chess. Now there is the opportunity to, in some way attack, belittle, berate, or and undermine, another chess player who happens to have more experience, knowledge and insight about chess matters than them, and many of their ilk combined. The point is that instead of just rubbishing the likes of Nigel Short or Kasparov, give them a chance? Listen to their ideas and take the good ones, and just scrutinize the rest.

At the end of the day, I have never exchanged more than a few words with Nigel Short, or for that matter, Kasparov, I do not know them personally, would not presume to judge them either, as some seem keen to do [I think I seen someone on this site or thread even describe Kasparov as a jerk! No doubt such a person will be the first to explain how arrogant Kasparov is and how little respect Kasparov shows people other chess players etc etc. But how on earth could one really know this? My guess would be that Kasparov is a rather complex individual with all the human frailties and failings that burden us all. Everyone is a jerk sometime or other- some are more worth forgiving than others.], but based on what is in the pubic domain they seem to know what they are talking about, genuinely seem to want to elevate chess to a better place, and want the support of people with similar aspirations. Seems fair enough to me.

In the specific case here of the ECF, apparently not being more appreciative of what they have in the person of Nigel Short as a servant of English chess, it does indeed look like he has been treated a bit like that fool on the hill.

But the fool on the hill, Sees the sun going down, And the eyes in his head, See the world spinning 'round. And he never listens to them, He knows that they're the fools. They don't like him

Mr Pleasant - The Kinks, that most English of bands that stem from the great 60s explosion of English pop culture. Perhaps we can say that there are many aspects to the sentiments expressed through the lyrics of this Kinks classic that could transpose to the person of Andrew Paulson and the drama unfolding?

Lets have a bit of fun and see if this is possible.

Oh Mr Paulson, how is Mrs Paulson?
I hope the world is treating you right,
And your head's in the air,
And you're feeling so proud,
'Cause you're such a success,
And the whole wide world is on your side, hey hey.
How are you today?

People say Mr Paulson is good,
Mr Paulson is kind,
Mr Pauslson okay,
Mr Paulson don't mind.
As long as Mr Paulson's all right, hey hey.
How are you today?
How's your father, how's your mother?
How's your sister, how's your brother?
How's your brand, new limousine,
Twenty-four inch TV screen?
Did you like prosperity
More than you liked poverty?
Life is easier, so much easier,
Life is easier now.

Considering the ongoing drama I would guess there is some cross over here, and I was tempted to include another Kinks classic; "A Well Respected Man" but that title did not seem to fit with the situation that see's him resigning.

http://youtu.be/4WsmSgBRUe4

Still some of the lyrics here too seem apt with the song offering a satirical commentary on the entrenched mores and conventions of the English upper and middle classes, while hinting at the frustration and casual hypocrisy that underlies this fastidiously maintained veneer of "respectability"

Cause he gets up in the morning,
And he goes to work at nine,
And he comes back home at five-thirty,
Gets the same train every time.
Cause his world is built round punctuality,
It never fails.

And he's oh, so good,
And he's oh, so fine,
And he's oh, so healthy,
In his body and his mind.
He's a well respected man about town,
Doing the best things so conservatively.

And he plays at stocks and shares,
And he goes to the regatta,

He's a well respected man about town,
Doing the best things so conservatively.

Presumably Andrew Paulson feels some affinity or affection for certain aspects of English society and culture, possibly without fully appreciating the far wider and more diverse features of English society and culture/s. World of a difference to be observed and experienced between Devon,Yorkshire, London and many other distinct regions within England. it is good to get out of London and explore the rest of England. Might be surprised by what one finds.

Lastly, given my own love of the Kinks classics it is hard to overlook one of the most wonderful and evocative pop songs ever: Waterloo Sunset. It seems to encapsulate the very essence of a romanticized view and experience of London, one which perhaps Andrew Paulson was drawn too? In any event, in the context of the ongoing drama and how it might play out, it sort of conjures up images of Andrew reflecting on the sunset of his presidency of the ECF. One can just imagine Andrew taking solace in the following lyrics, not to mention the incredibly haunting music.

http://youtu.be/g-D9xcZgKX4

Dirty old river, must you keep rolling
Flowing into the night
People so busy, makes me feel dizzy
Taxi light shines so bright
But I don't need no friends
As long as I gaze on Waterloo sunset
I am in paradise

Every day I look at the world from my window
But chilly, chilly is evening time
Waterloo sunset's fine

But as those Four Yorkshiremen http://youtu.be/Xe1a1wHxTyo would explain, if you try telling the young people of today about how things were in the old days, they won't believe you!

To conclude [and not before time I hear you say] this whole drama has all the ingredients for a play, maybe even a West End production, maybe on Broadway? A musical, as mapped out, in part, above?

What should the title of this drama be?

"Emergency Board Meeting Draft Minutes"

Is certainly not going to cut it.

How about "The Twilight Zone Of English Chess"

Nah doesn't have the right ring to it really. Ah well, I am open to suggestions.

Maybe just

"Knights In Light Satin Sheets" - any old excuse to include another classic from another great English band from the 60s http://youtu.be/9muzyOd4Lh8

[PeterFarr]

Colm,

An extraordinary tour de force of a post.

Can't hope to match your creativity, but just hope we don't suffer the last lines of 'Won't Get Fooled Again' again: 'meet the new boss; same as the old boss'.