Kasparov vs Ilyumzhinov: the FIDE Presidency battle begins

[John McKenna]

Nick sometimes exaggerates - as above.
Is Putin pulling all Ilyumshinov's strings?
Surely Kirsan has two free hands, but both somewhat soiled.
Garry has at least one clean hand as far as I can see from what Nick says.

Edited to correct 'Gary' to Garry - as it was an honest misspelling, honest.
Edited 2nd time to add the second 'honest'.
Edit: I seem to be in a loop...

[NickFaulks]

?

Gary has at least one clean hand as far as I can see from what Nick says.

What do you mean? I'm not saying he hasn't, just that my post said nothing relevant to your comment.

[Nigel Short]

Nick sometimes exaggerates - as above.
Is Putin pulling all Ilyumshinov's strings?
Surely Kirsan has two free hands, but both somewhat soiled.
Gary has at least one clean hand as far as I can see from what Nick says.

Russian Embassies are calling federations all around the world to vote for Ilyumzhinov. Or at least they are doing it in such disparate places as Tanzania and Ireland. Actually Tanzania doesn't even have a vote, but they were asked why Kasparov was invited recently.

[Roger de Coverly]

Russian Embassies are calling federations all around the world to vote for Ilyumzhinov. Or at least they are doing it in such disparate places as Tanzania and Ireland.

These Sports Scholarships that the FIDE site has been boasting about recently. If they are taken up, who pays? Is it Kirsan himself, FIDE or the Russian Government?

[NickFaulks]

Russian Embassies are calling federations all around the world to vote for Ilyumzhinov. Or at least they are doing it in such disparate places as Tanzania and Ireland.

These Sports Scholarships that the FIDE site has been boasting about recently. If they are taken up, who pays? Is it Kirsan himself, FIDE or the Russian Government?

I don't see how FIDE can pay directly, since there is no budget for such activity. I expect these will come from Kirsan, probably funnelled through Chess in Schools ( or Playzone, if you can tell them apart ).

On Tanzania, I'm assuming that they will have a vote in time for Tromso, so are worth courting.

Going back to the West African story, it seems that these federations are taking what they can get from both sides ( believe me, that letter was not signed without an inducement ) and then they will vote according to their best interests. I find it hard to criticise that approach.

[Roger de Coverly]

Going back to the West African story, it seems that these federations are taking what they can get from both sides ( believe me, that letter was not signed without an inducement ) and then they will vote according to their best interests. I find it hard to criticise that approach.

You accept then that FIDE elections are won by the team with the deepest pockets. The opinions of people who actually play chess are worthless.

FIDE never follow their own rules, so precedents could well be irrelevant. But isn't there a residual power similar to the power of the ECF voting membership to evict an unsatisfactory President or Board? Something like that was invoked to dump Campomanes in favour of Kirsan, well outside of the election timetable.

[Nigel Short]

"On Tanzania, I'm assuming that they will have a vote in time for Tromso, so are worth courting."

No, Nick. The statutes were changed in 2012 (as a consequence of the legal action by the ECF). Among many other beneficial changes, this prevented newly formed federations from having the vote immediately - which was invariably worth something to the incumbent.

[Chris Rice]

Follow up piece by Peter Doggers on the statements by the West African Federations.

http://www.chessvibes.com/joint-declara ... -elections

A few points of interest:

1. You have to agree with GK's anger that KI is using the FIDE.com site to campaign. KI really should set up a seperate one although of course that would conflict with KI's portrayal that he is FIDE.

2. Yazicki's tweets are unbelievable.

3. Graham Jurgensen - accusations that this guy who I haven't heard about before was the director of Kasparov's African chess campaign. Nothing substantive given in the way of evidence except a reference to GK's website but I did find an interview in 2012 which seems to prove that Mr Jurgensen is leading the African effort for GK. Mr Jurgensen has a current FIDE rating of 2070 and holds the prestigious CM title which you get if you ever have a FIDE rating of 2200. Obtaining this title was a magnificent achievement bearing in mind that Mr Jurgensen's Elo apparently never got higher than 2116.

http://www.parasgudka.com/blog/intervie ... on-africa/

http://ratings.fide.com/card.phtml?event=14300788

[JustinHorton]

The opinions of people who actually play chess are worthless.

Who has actually sought those people's opinions?

Of course it's about deep pockets. Both sides are playing that game. Both sides are in the business of offering financial inducements, to put it euphemistically.

[Roger de Coverly]

Mr Jurgensen has a current FIDE rating of 2070 and holds the prestigious CM title which you get if you ever have a FIDE rating of 2200. Obtaining this title was a magnificent achievement bearing in mind that Mr Jurgensen's Elo apparently never got higher than 2116.

You can win the CM title as a Prize for doing well in FIDE events, which can include junior ones that might not in the past have been rated. I agree though, there's nothing in his playing history to show how he got the title. Also I believe the title can be claimed if you touch 2200 during a tournament, equally that's unlikely from an all time high of 2116.

[David Sedgwick]

"On Tanzania, I'm assuming that they will have a vote in time for Tromso, so are worth courting."

No, Nick. The statutes were changed in 2012 (as a consequence of the legal action by the ECF). Among many other beneficial changes, this prevented newly formed federations from having the vote immediately - which was invariably worth something to the incumbent.

Tanzania were admitted to membership at the Tallinn Congress 2013. Won't that give them a vote in Tromso?

Moreover, if what you say is correct, then the statutes published on the FIDE website are out of date:

From Statute A2.2: "A new member can fully participate in all meetings of FIDE, including the right to vote, from the moment it is accepted for membership by the General Assembly."

Source: http://www.fide.com/fide/handbook.html? ... ew=article.

Or am I missing something?

[NickFaulks]

Going back to the West African story, it seems that these federations are taking what they can get from both sides ( believe me, that letter was not signed without an inducement ) and then they will vote according to their best interests. I find it hard to criticise that approach.

You accept then that FIDE elections are won by the team with the deepest pockets. The opinions of people who actually play chess are worthless.

No, that is precisely what I am NOT saying. They will accept whatever benevolence is forthcoming from both sides ( why would you turn down chess scholarships? ) and then, in a secret ballot, vote for the candidate who they think will most benefit chess in their country. There is no reason to assume that the opinions of the federations on that matter will differ from those of their members. West African federations have to explain their actions to their members just like the ECF, and quite possibly make a better job of it.

[Roger de Coverly]

They will accept whatever benevolence is forthcoming from both sides ( why would you turn down chess scholarships? )

Surely the offer of chess scholarships is conditional on agreeing to support the campaign of those offering such largesse? It comes back as to who is paying for them. Wasn't the Kok campaign in 2006 accused of being naive in presuming election support would be determined solely by personality and policies? If FIDE insiders are so upset at Kasparov using the Rotten Boroughs democracy of FIDE against them, the solution is in their own hands to widen the franchise.

[NickFaulks]

Everyone here seems to assume that the offer of chess scholarships will now be withdrawn. Personally, I am not expecting that.

[David Sedgwick]

"On Tanzania, I'm assuming that they will have a vote in time for Tromso, so are worth courting."

No, Nick. The statutes were changed in 2012 (as a consequence of the legal action by the ECF). Among many other beneficial changes, this prevented newly formed federations from having the vote immediately - which was invariably worth something to the incumbent.

Tanzania were admitted to membership at the Tallinn Congress 2013. Won't that give them a vote in Tromso?

Moreover, if what you say is correct, then the statutes published on the FIDE website are out of date:

From Statute A2.2: "A new member can fully participate in all meetings of FIDE, including the right to vote, from the moment it is accepted for membership by the General Assembly."

Source: http://www.fide.com/fide/handbook.html? ... ew=article.

Or am I missing something?

The answer to my semi-rhetorical question is "Yes, I am".

I checked the position with Nigel Freeman, FIDE Treasurer and Executive Director, and I quote his reply.

"These three* Federations will only become full voting members after the elections have taken place in Tromso. They do have a right to participate in all FIDE events, including the Olympiad."

*This refers to Tanzania, Saudi Arabia and Timor-Leste, all of which were admitted to FIDE membership at Tallinn Congress 2013.

I still don't understand why, but I certainly stand corrected. My apologies to Nigel S.