ICL Pathway (Fujitsu) Curiosity
-
- Posts: 4844
- Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2007 1:13 am
- Location: Bideford
Re: ICL Pathway (Fujitsu) Curiosity
I once met someone who had an interesting take on this, along the lines of "the government tries to outsource activities which it is not very good at, which is a perfectly reasonable strategy in itself; unfortunately, the things this government is not very good at include procurement and outsourcing".
-
- Posts: 3584
- Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2008 4:31 pm
- Location: Awbridge, Hampshire
Re: ICL Pathway (Fujitsu) Curiosity
Quite likely. It reminds me of an incident with the Surrey Border League bank account a few years ago.
A league official who was an authorised user of the league's account went in to a branch to make a cash withdrawal from his personal account with the bank using his debit card. The money was incorrectly debited from the league's account instead of his personal account. Presumably down to human error, but how could a system be designed to let it happen - the league's account required 2 people to authorise transactions and he did this on his own; the league's account didn't have a debit card associated with it.
-
- Posts: 7282
- Joined: Wed Apr 04, 2007 10:29 am
- Location: Cove, Hampshire, England.
Re: ICL Pathway (Fujitsu) Curiosity
Fairly explosive: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-67884743
British Chess News : britishchessnews.com
Twitter: @BritishChess
Facebook: facebook.com/groups/britishchess
Twitter: @BritishChess
Facebook: facebook.com/groups/britishchess
-
- Posts: 8874
- Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2010 2:34 am
- Location: London
Re: ICL Pathway (Fujitsu) Curiosity
Another article here:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67956962
A cautionary point made here:
Do you really think ministers will get justice for Post Office victims? Ask the Windrush families and think again (Amelia Gentleman writing in The Guardian)
Awful failures of government and of systems. It sounds trite to say it, but lessons really have to be learned.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-67956962
The pressure needs to be kept on to get (proper) compensation paid out.In one emotional scene, a panic-stricken Jo begins trying to balance the books after a long day. The Horizon software shows losses doubling in front of her eyes, yet her concerns are dismissed by a helpline operator.
A cautionary point made here:
Do you really think ministers will get justice for Post Office victims? Ask the Windrush families and think again (Amelia Gentleman writing in The Guardian)
Awful failures of government and of systems. It sounds trite to say it, but lessons really have to be learned.
-
- Posts: 5872
- Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:28 pm
Re: ICL Pathway (Fujitsu) Curiosity
"I once met someone who had an interesting take on this, along the lines of "the government tries to outsource activities which it is not very good at, which is a perfectly reasonable strategy in itself; unfortunately, the things this government is not very good at include procurement and outsourcing"."
That applies to all governments (or companies, for that matter) - if they are not good at something, they don't know if the people they recruit are any good also...
This guy is good...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDc2NRoQOM4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQzrB3kuqck
That applies to all governments (or companies, for that matter) - if they are not good at something, they don't know if the people they recruit are any good also...
This guy is good...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jDc2NRoQOM4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQzrB3kuqck
-
- Posts: 2155
- Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 1:37 am
Re: ICL Pathway (Fujitsu) Curiosity
If I recall, Amelia Gentleman did a great job exposing the awful treatment of the Windrush generation.Christopher Kreuzer wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2024 6:38 pmA cautionary point made here:
Do you really think ministers will get justice for Post Office victims? Ask the Windrush families and think again (Amelia Gentleman writing in The Guardian)
-
- Posts: 2155
- Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 1:37 am
Re: ICL Pathway (Fujitsu) Curiosity
The major selling point for outsourcing is that you appoint an outside organisation with the expertise and resources you don't have. I suspect, though (from my experience in IT), that it's often better to do things in-house, if necessary through employment of staff with suitable expertise or training of existing staff. One organisation I worked for which outsourced also, at the same time, took a stake in a company it outsourced to. But that project ended in dismal failure. From what I've seen, outsourcing organisations often get screwed when projects don't work out and when new things are needed which weren't anticipated in the first place... One time, though, I was assigned to a major project for a Government department and the company I worked for didn't deliver and were absolutely nailed down with the invocation of compensation clauses. My employer then compounded their error by taking on new sub projects to try to recoup their losses but were reliant on already badly-overworked staff.Kevin Thurlow wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2024 12:12 am"I once met someone who had an interesting take on this, along the lines of "the government tries to outsource activities which it is not very good at, which is a perfectly reasonable strategy in itself; unfortunately, the things this government is not very good at include procurement and outsourcing"."
That applies to all governments (or companies, for that matter) - if they are not good at something, they don't know if the people they recruit are any good also...
Another thing: while the organisations which are outsourced to have expertise, I've seen that sometimes they don't organise themselves well and they think that staff can be switched in and out of a project at no cost (in terms of getting up to speed with what they're asked to do) and sometimes they subcontract (which can be expensive). From what I saw there was an over-reliance on people who didn't really have a vested interest in the success of project - a situation which I think would be different if projects were carried out in-house.
Last edited by Angus French on Thu Jan 18, 2024 8:45 pm, edited 3 times in total.
-
- Posts: 5280
- Joined: Tue Mar 31, 2009 11:51 pm
- Location: Millom, Cumbria
Re: ICL Pathway (Fujitsu) Curiosity
Still hard to quite believe who she is actually married to.Angus French wrote: ↑Thu Jan 18, 2024 7:16 pmIf I recall, Amelia Gentleman did a great job exposing the awful treatment of the Windrush generation.Christopher Kreuzer wrote: ↑Wed Jan 17, 2024 6:38 pmA cautionary point made here:
Do you really think ministers will get justice for Post Office victims? Ask the Windrush families and think again (Amelia Gentleman writing in The Guardian)
"Set up your attacks so that when the fire is out, it isn't out!" (H N Pillsbury)
-
- Posts: 8874
- Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2010 2:34 am
- Location: London
Re: ICL Pathway (Fujitsu) Curiosity
From this article:
Fujitsu will never be held accountable for the Post Office scandal. It is too important to this government
Fujitsu will never be held accountable for the Post Office scandal. It is too important to this government
Frightening. How do we know the next miscarriage of justice is not already brewing or has happened?The reality is that Fujitsu doesn’t need to make products that work well. It doesn’t need to be honest about its failures. Until they were found out, Fujitsu, the Post Office, and even ministers were happy to let sub-postmasters pay the price for Fujitsu to keep making profits from the public purse. When you have Fujitsu’s access and influence, real accountability is for other people.
-
- Posts: 729
- Joined: Sat Apr 30, 2011 1:07 pm
Re: ICL Pathway (Fujitsu) Curiosity
Of course it is/has. It's in the DNA of modern-day business culture and those who operate within it. No commitment to providing quality goods or services. Swan into a job, grab your bonuses, loot your expense accounts, swan out again before your errors (or even depredations) come to light, add another "shining success" to the old CV, maybe even a gong or title, and off to the next trough.Christopher Kreuzer wrote: ↑Fri Jan 19, 2024 8:58 pmHow do we know the next miscarriage of justice is not already brewing or has happened?
And don't imagine it's a recent phenomenon. Quote from J B Priestley's Bright Day (published 1946, part-set in 1912-14):
"But these smart chaps who know nowt but 'ow to make money fast, they 'ave no customers, they're 'ere today an' gone tomorrow, and only thing they've a respect for is money. An' Ah tell you, lad, they're no good to themselves nor nobody else."
"The chess-board is the world ..... the player on the other side is hidden from us ..... he never overlooks a mistake, or makes the smallest allowance for ignorance."
(He doesn't let you resign and start again, either.)
(He doesn't let you resign and start again, either.)
-
- Posts: 21367
- Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 2:51 pm