Poor taste

Debate directly related to English Chess Federation matters.
Matthew Turner
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Re: Poor taste

Post by Matthew Turner » Mon Aug 16, 2010 2:26 pm

So the ECF are not going to promote the visit of Karpov and Kasparov, I guess that will give them more time to promote the Himlayan Grandmasters on their homepage :D
I feel the ECF should be right behind the promotion of the Dinner, it is an important event in English Chess

Leonard Barden
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Re: Poor taste

Post by Leonard Barden » Mon Aug 16, 2010 2:35 pm

I absolutely agree with the previous two posts. CJ, in my book you are probably the best President the BCF/ECF has ever had and nothing I have written above alters that. The ECF and the other home countries have all come out in support of Karpov, so it would look bizarre indeed if the ECF website suddenly cut out mentions of the splendid event you have conceived and organised.
All I am saying is that the press release (which should be published by the ECF) would be much better if the extraterriestial references were completely removed and/or replaced by more concrete criticisms. My last post as a professional journalist who frequently has to amend his copy was simply a suggestion of how to do this. Good luck with your valuable work!

andrew martin

Re: Poor taste

Post by andrew martin » Mon Aug 16, 2010 2:38 pm

Mention of Karpov's primary policies for change would also not go amiss. Substance is required if the election is to be won.

Jon D'Souza-Eva

Re: Poor taste

Post by Jon D'Souza-Eva » Mon Aug 16, 2010 2:40 pm

Isn't the stuff about Ilyumzhinov claiming to having been abducted by aliens true? It was reported on the BBC website (usually very reliable) as being from a TV interview with him:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/8662822.stm

If so the press release as it was initially posted on the ECF site seems hardly controversial at all.

Sean Hewitt

Re: Poor taste

Post by Sean Hewitt » Mon Aug 16, 2010 2:48 pm

It's impossible to comment on the suitability of the statment without knowing who the statement is from. Is it the Karpov Presidential ticket, is it CJ de Mooi (Organiser of the Staunton Memorial Dinner) or is it CJ de Mooi (ECF President)?

If it's either of the first two then quite frankly it can say whatever it likes, but I don't think it has any business appearing on the ECF website.

If it's the latter though, then I think it should be

a) toned down in the way Leonard Barden suggests ; and
b) agreed by the ECF board before being published

Matthew Turner
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Re: Poor taste

Post by Matthew Turner » Mon Aug 16, 2010 3:07 pm

You cannot have everything approved by the whole board or else nothing would ever happen.

David Sedgwick
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Re: Poor taste

Post by David Sedgwick » Mon Aug 16, 2010 4:32 pm

cjdemooi wrote:The release will not be published on the ECF and I will not use federation resources to promote it, the conference or the dinner. Nothing will be issued from the ECF office and I have not asked any staff to edit or send anything... they have more than enough to do without added rubbish from me.

I am simply trying (and working long unpaid hours) to achieve something spectacular that will promote chess in the UK.

By the time I've finished my first (only?) term as ECF President, I'll have spent about £9000 of my own money, so that should be proof enough I have no ulterior motive and only want what's best. However, as I've said, I will not nominate myself for re-election and am happy to stand down whenever required.
CJ, I hope that the organisations with which I'm connected will nominate you again, as they did last year.

However, you did ask for comments on your latest draft. Leonard, who has vast experience as a journalist, made what I felt were constructive and helpful criticisms.

Regardless of the capacity in which you're issuing it, I hope that the revised press release will appear on the ECF website. It contains important information.

As with everything else on the site, such publication should be subject to the explicit or implicit approval of Stewart Reuben as the responsible Director. In my view it's over the top to say that the approval of the Board as a whole should be needed.

Sean Hewitt

Re: Poor taste

Post by Sean Hewitt » Mon Aug 16, 2010 4:45 pm

David Sedgwick wrote:In my view it's over the top to say that the approval of the Board as a whole should be needed.
I can't see that that a need for approval of the Board as a whole has been suggested anywhere
:oops:
Last edited by Sean Hewitt on Mon Aug 16, 2010 11:20 pm, edited 2 times in total.

David Sedgwick
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Re: Poor taste

Post by David Sedgwick » Mon Aug 16, 2010 4:57 pm

Sean Hewitt wrote:It's impossible to comment on the suitability of the statment without knowing who the statement is from. Is it the Karpov Presidential ticket, is it CJ de Mooi (Organiser of the Staunton Memorial Dinner) or is it CJ de Mooi (ECF President)?

If it's either of the first two then quite frankly it can say whatever it likes, but I don't think it has any business appearing on the ECF website.

If it's the latter though, then I think it should be

a) toned down in the way Leonard Barden suggests ; and
b) agreed by the ECF board before being published
Sean Hewitt wrote:
David Sedgwick wrote:In my view it's over the top to say that the approval of the Board as a whole should be needed.
I can't see that that a need for approval of the Board as a whole has been suggested anywhere
:oops:
Well I can, unless I'm missing something.
Last edited by David Sedgwick on Mon Aug 16, 2010 11:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Stewart Reuben
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Re: Poor taste

Post by Stewart Reuben » Mon Aug 16, 2010 5:38 pm

Concerning the ECF website, the rule has been, and still is, that all postings by Directors are accepted by the webmaster.
I have been in office for just two weeks in a holiday period. The relationship between the rest of the Board and me will no doubt evolve. But things are much improved since 2008 now many Board members post regularly.

Stewart Reuben

Simon Brown
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Re: Poor taste

Post by Simon Brown » Mon Aug 16, 2010 5:51 pm

Oh please.

We finally have a President who is making a huge contribution to chess in this country, both in terms of his time and his own money. He listens to people. As this thread shows, he is happy to admit to an error of judgement, to take the blame and apologise (not necessary, to my mind). He uses his initiative, his position and his contacts for the good of chess. We should be grateful to him.

Yet we persist in questioning his authority, wondering whether he has the support of the Board, asking whether he is acting personally or on behalf of the ECF, etc., etc..

To see Karpov and Kasparov together, in London, to launch their bid for the FIDE presidency, is great news. I don't care if the ECF supports it, promotes it, organises it or not. I don't care if Ray Keene is involved or not. It is a high-profile chess event happening in the UK, and that has to be good news. And our President is responsible for it - good for him.

A lot of talented people have either left the BCF/ECF, or refused to become involved, because too many people think that the good of the organisation is more important than the good of chess. Let's hope CJ doesn't join the list.

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Paul Littlewood
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Re: Poor taste

Post by Paul Littlewood » Mon Aug 16, 2010 6:36 pm

Hear, hear....keep up the good work CJ !

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Gavin Strachan
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Re: Poor taste

Post by Gavin Strachan » Tue Aug 17, 2010 12:41 am

I have to agree with Andrew that although Kirzan is not the preferred candidate the language is somewhat disparaging of him and would perhaps only serve to help him by ridiculing the Karpov campaign. You equally could slag of Karpov with his hair washing (or lack of) during long matches for instance, but it is all a bit playground. It also looks bad for the ECF to have this on the front page and really should take a more sensible approach in promoting Karpov’s campaign. I have no problems with jokes, but that is not the right place.

On the subject of Aliens, what if Kirzan was abducted by aliens... universe is a very big place!

Kevin Thurlow
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Re: Poor taste

Post by Kevin Thurlow » Tue Aug 17, 2010 8:17 am

I agree with Simon.

I don't think it unreasonable to mention that the current FIDE President is colourful or controversial (after all, he claimed to be abducted by aliens, so he cannot complain if people repeat that), but you have to be slightly careful how you do it. It's probably best not to mention more serious allegations, unless you can prove them.

And of course the Karpov team should concentrate on, "how we are going to improve things".

And CJ, don't go!
"Kevin was the arbiter and was very patient. " Nick Grey

Stewart Reuben
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Re: Poor taste

Post by Stewart Reuben » Tue Aug 17, 2010 10:55 am

Gavin Strachan >On the subject of Aliens, what if Kirzan was abducted by aliens... universe is a very big place!<

The problem is that they are not members of FIDE Federations and thus cannot have their ratings published. I believe there is to be a proposal coming before FIDE TO rectify this.

Stewart Reuben

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