The English Language

A section to discuss matters not related to Chess in particular.
Robert Stokes
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Re: little

Post by Robert Stokes » Mon Apr 21, 2014 5:57 pm

It could be one of those unnecessary words that people sometimes include for no particular reason. My pet hate is starting a sentence with "up until . . . " I've never yet met such a sentence where the 'up' can't be omitted without changing the meaning. (I nearly put 'at all' at the end of the last sentence thus including unnecessary words.)

Robert

soheil_hooshdaran
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Re: little

Post by soheil_hooshdaran » Mon Apr 21, 2014 6:33 pm

Someone said he is using it metaphorically. What is he making out of it?

It is the start of a chapter on pawn structure:
Clearly the weakest man on the board. the little pawn may seem unimportant. In reality. though. the pawn is the foundation upon which most chess strategies are built. The great Polish Grandmaster Saviely Tartakower (1887-1956) was not joking when he wrote, "Never lose a pawn and you will never lose a game."
The previous time I was forced to make up a poem........I just need to know the meaning.
Last edited by soheil_hooshdaran on Mon Apr 21, 2014 9:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Robert Stokes
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Re: little

Post by Robert Stokes » Mon Apr 21, 2014 7:32 pm

My point exactly - take 'little' out of the above quotation and it does not change the meaning. Having said that, the writer might be emphasising the point that a pawn, although the least valuable chess man on the board, is nevertheless not to be lost without consequence - it can hold together the whole position.

Robert

Stewart Reuben
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Re: little

Post by Stewart Reuben » Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:45 am

Soheil Hooshdaran .Clearly the weakest man on the board. the little pawn may seem unimportant. (from Play Winning Chess),

There have been responses which are clearly not helpful. Try changing the very old statement to:

Clearly the weakest piece on the board, the pawn may seem unimportant. But, it is a little like bricks in a building. Together the 8 pawns for each player provides the basis of the edifice that they build in each game.

Use of the word 'man' shows that it is an out of date statement. The term 'man' for chess pieces is no longer used.
It is also simplistic. In the endgame two pawns on the sixth rank are usually superior to a rook.

soheil_hooshdaran
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Re: little

Post by soheil_hooshdaran » Wed Apr 30, 2014 3:23 am

What do you guys do with the 'little'?

Aben Rudy said that the author wanted to be cute and not related to the chess info, and I answered I have to preserve the cuteness because the author wanted the book to be both instructive and fun to read.

MSoszynski
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Re: little

Post by MSoszynski » Wed Apr 30, 2014 7:21 am

Robert Stokes wrote:It could be one of those unnecessary words that people sometimes include for no particular reason. My pet hate is starting a sentence with "up until . . . " I've never yet met such a sentence where the 'up' can't be omitted without changing the meaning. (I nearly put 'at all' at the end of the last sentence thus including unnecessary words.)

Robert
Up until now intensifies the idea of the passing of time over until now. When we overlook the possibility of nuances and subtleties like these, we brutalise our own language.

soheil_hooshdaran
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left to one's own devices

Post by soheil_hooshdaran » Wed Apr 30, 2014 9:20 am

Hi.
What dies "left to his own devices" mean exactly(I'm looking for the smallest nuances ) in:

I was just 13, and my opponent, also a young boy, was making his moves very quickly. It was obvious that hod memorized this particular opening and was repeating the- moves of some famous Grandmaster. Cautiously. I picked my way through his opening “minefield" and was only slightly behind when the middlegame started. He finally Began to slow down, taking more time to think over his moves. “At least we're out of the book now, and he's on his own,"I thought with a good deal of relief. The battle was joined and I needed to concentrate.

Ten moves later my opponent resigned. It became obvious that he had a good memory but understood little about the principles of chess. Left to his own devices, his game fell apart remarkably quickly.

?Thanks in advance

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Michael Farthing
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Re: left to one's own devices

Post by Michael Farthing » Wed Apr 30, 2014 9:32 am

A mixture of these ideas:

Depend on his own skills
Having to make his own decisions
Not having help from someone else (in this case, his memory of his chess studies).

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Jon Mahony
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Re: left to one's own devices

Post by Jon Mahony » Wed Apr 30, 2014 10:23 am

“Left to his own devices” - something you should not be allowed to do on this forum, or we will get more of these daft threads started :roll:
"When you see a good move, look for a better one!" - Lasker

Robert Stokes
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Re: little

Post by Robert Stokes » Wed Apr 30, 2014 12:04 pm

I don't want to labour the point, but I would be interested in an example sentence where you thought that the 'up' at the front made a noticeable difference.

Robert

P.S. Perhaps it's the mathematician in me. The best mathematical statement or proof is the one which gives all of the required information with the minimum of symbols.

Robert Stokes
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Re: left to one's own devices

Post by Robert Stokes » Wed Apr 30, 2014 12:11 pm

"Left to his own devises" meant that he had to start thinking for himself and could no longer rely on a remembered sequence of good moves that someone else had worked out for him.

Robert

Graham Borrowdale

Re: left to one's own devices

Post by Graham Borrowdale » Wed Apr 30, 2014 12:49 pm

If only our top GMs were left to their own devices...

MSoszynski
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Re: little

Post by MSoszynski » Wed Apr 30, 2014 1:57 pm

Robert Stokes wrote:I don't want to labour the point, but I would be interested in an example sentence where you thought that the 'up' at the front made a noticeable difference.

Robert

P.S. Perhaps it's the mathematician in me. The best mathematical statement or proof is the one which gives all of the required information with the minimum of symbols.
In every example there will be a difference; but you won't notice it - at least you hadn't up till now.

The up stresses the passage of time. Without the up it's the present that is stressed.

Think of up till now as (in some ways, not all) short for all the way up till now.

You do see that there is a changed emphasis between till now and all the way up till now, don't you?

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JustinHorton
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Re: left to one's own devices

Post by JustinHorton » Wed Apr 30, 2014 3:49 pm

"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

lostontime.blogspot.com

soheil_hooshdaran
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Re: little

Post by soheil_hooshdaran » Wed Apr 30, 2014 5:17 pm

Some people feel intensification is unnecessary and redundant

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