Kasparov vs Ilyumzhinov: the FIDE Presidency battle begins

[Roger de Coverly]

Great article on the Chess Drum site regarding "Gabon-Gate" the origins of the dispute go right back to a "zero tolerance" dispute at the Dresden Olympiad in 2008.

I'm not sure 2008 had anything to do with the origins of the dispute, rather that it showed that the now disqualified organisation had been the national affiliate for six years without anyone querying that it was an association rather than a federation. If the form of words matters, then both the ICU and WCU should watch out, as they are Unions rather than Federations. Chess Scotland don't disclose their nature in their name.

I think it's quite obvious that had the older body declared for Kirsan, as it did in 2010, none of this would have happened.

[Paolo Casaschi]

What else?

One of them made a speech advocating zero time default across all forms of chess. In my view, that shows such poor judgement as to permanently disqualify him from any chess office. It's not helped that the rival candidate had adopted as co-runner, the second greatest advocate of this policy, but you might hope that an ex-world champion would show respect for the history and traditions of chess, something the existing president has a track record of disrespecting from when he first became president nineteen years ago.

Again, in practical terms, how would that affect average John? The zero tolerance of your example has not affected average John in any way. Any other practical example?

[Matthew Turner]

Paolo,
Those are interesting points but I would say

1. Most Johns are very happy to support junior chess/chess in schools. If someone enjoys a game then they will want others to have the opportunity to do so. There doesn't need to be a direct benefit to John himself.

2. John will probably find it a bit embarrassing that chess enters the general public sphere when the president of FIDE visits Saddam Hussein or Muammar Gaddafi. We could get into a long debate about Gaddafi's health and education provision compared to today's Libya or other states in the region, but that doesn't happen that often down the pub.

3. John will probably idolise Kasparov somewhat as a great chessplayer

John would almost certainly vote for Kasparov and be quite surprised that someone would vote for Kirsan. This attitude is likely to convince John that Kirsan is a crook; After all, he cannot see why someone would vote for him so his votes must be secured corruptly.

Things might be different if John was say African?

[Roger de Coverly]

Again, in practical terms, how would that affect average John? The zero tolerance of your example has not affected average John in any way. Any other practical example?

Only because it was realised by other members of the FIDE Presidential Board how much harm it could do either to chess in general or FIDE in particular. It affects anyone playing in an official FIDE event. This would include the average John's children.

[Michael Farthing]

No one seems actually to be asking me.
I don't give a sausage.
My child isn't interested in chess.

Average John

[Paolo Casaschi]

Again, in practical terms, how would that affect average John? The zero tolerance of your example has not affected average John in any way. Any other practical example?

Only because it was realised by other members of the FIDE Presidential Board how much harm it could do either to chess in general or FIDE in particular. It affects anyone playing in an official FIDE event. This would include the average John's children.

Again principles and general concepts... I get that... how do those translate into something tangible for average John?

[Roger de Coverly]

[ how do those translate into something tangible for average John?

If the FIDE President had his way and introduced zero time default, this would have been set aside for local leagues and Congresses. This is most likely what will happen with the new and ambiguous mobile phone rules.

The problem would have arisen with events like the 4NCL and e2e4 tournaments. If enforcing zero time default had become a condition of FIDE rating, which way would they have jumped?

[Roger de Coverly]

I think it's quite obvious that had the older body declared for Kirsan, as it did in 2010, none of this would have happened.

It isn't dated, but from the context, it must have been 2010.
http://uganda.fide.com/component/conten ... ederations

One of the pictures is captioned

FIDE President and the President of Gabon Chess Federation Bongo Akanga NDJILA BARTHELEMY

[Bill Porter]

John would almost certainly vote for Kasparov and be quite surprised that someone would vote for Kirsan. This attitude is likely to convince John that Kirsan is a crook; After all, he cannot see why someone would vote for him so his votes must be secured corruptly.

Things might be different if John was say African?

Good to see someone who has a proper appreciation that ordinary chess players aren't clever enough to see what's best for them.

[Matthew Turner]

Bill,
I don't understand your comment at all. I am saying that it is perfectly logical for a Western European 'club' player to support Kasparov. Whether I am more 'informed' or not is a moot point, but I would support Kasparov for basically the same reasons. However, it may well be that players across the spectrum of abilities around the world will have a different perspective for equally sensible and logical reasons.

[David Sedgwick]

It isn't dated, but from the context, it must have been 2010.
http://uganda.fide.com/component/conten ... ederations

It does in fact say ©2010 at the foot of the page.

Thank you for the link to a very interesting article which I had not previously seen.

[Roger de Coverly]

As I understand the situation, there are currently issues about four Federations: Gabon, Afghanistan, Papua New Guinea and Vietnam.

The somewhat shadowy organisation chessnewsagency.com is now claiming that the Afghanistan president was ousted for corruption.
http://chessnewsagency.com/#/afghanista ... president/

Cynics can make the obvious observation that it would not have mattered, even if true, had he declared for Kirsan.

It's a dimension to FIDE's one Federation one vote "democracy" as to what extent a Government can dictate who is the FIDE Delegate. I would be willing to be proved wrong, but I don't think the UK government would claim power of dismissal, even for heavily funded sports. It would be more subtle by withdrawing grants for organisations that politicians or more likely civil servants didn't approve of.

[Paolo Casaschi]

I would be willing to be proved wrong, but I don't think the UK government would claim power of dismissal, even for heavily funded sports. It would be more subtle by withdrawing grants for organisations that politicians or more likely civil servants didn't approve of.

In some countries the chess federation is member of their National Olympic committee (the FIDE website lists which ones); that usually provides not only access to funding but also some kind of supervision. If the Paulson affair had happened in Italy, the issue of a recused president with alleged secret deals on the side would probably have been handled by the Olympic committee; I can't remember this happening to chess, but it's not uncommon for the Olympic committee to appoint an emergency administrator for other sports when their governing body had major internal issues. You might see this as an intrusion and a limitation of freedom, but it actually makes things work and really helps especially during a crisis; an added benefit, it also provides members an escalation path for complains, resulting in a better efficiency in handling complains internally because nobody wants to be investigated by the Olympic committee. You might also assume it's all corrupted anyway, but then if the governememt is so corrupted the administration of the chess federation should not be you main worry.

[JustinHorton]

There's a similar situation with football in which FIFA has always refused to accept governmental interference in football federations, with the reasonable justification of avoiding political meddling but the practical effect of preventing action against incompetence and corruption. Some country called FIFA's bluff on this recently and won, but I can't remember which one.

[Chris Rice]

An interesting article in the Canadian online newspaper The Globe and Mail which highlights the surprise decision for the Canadians to back Illyumzhinov in the election. The President of the Canadian Chess federation, Mr Drkulec said that they had started out favouring Kasparov but in his attempts to win support GK had been really insulting to such an extent they decided to vote for Illyumzhinov. In response it seems GK's camp effectively responded by saying that the people running the Canadian chess federation were a bunch of old dinosaurs anyway.

GK also believes Putin's going out of his way to block him by calling chess federations and asking them to vote for Illyumzhinov, the latest being Ukraine no less.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/wor ... d/follows/