Cheating in chess

Discuss anything you like about chess related matters in this forum.
Roger de Coverly
Posts: 19271
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 2:51 pm

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Roger de Coverly » Sat Nov 14, 2020 6:21 pm

Geoff Chandler wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 3:56 pm
Viesturs Meijers who was the GM loser in this Ist round Morra Gambit ended up winning the tournament.

Not a line I know anything about, or the Morra Gambit in general having discovered that if prepared to defend c3 Sicilians, that's all you need to know ( 1.e4 c5 2. d4 cxd4 3. c3 Nf6)

With engine assistance, these seem to be the critical points.



Provoking e5 seems unwise, with .. a6, .. e6, .. Bd7 or even .. h6 suggested as slightly better alternatives.

Even so, Black still has a pawn in compensation for the suffering, but it doesn't completely slip until

with .. Rb7 suggested as the defence to hold things together. That had already been played, admittedly in obscure 1990s junior tournaments.





Roger Lancaster
Posts: 1076
Joined: Tue Mar 17, 2015 2:44 pm

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Roger Lancaster » Sat Nov 21, 2020 1:33 pm

It's something of a distraction from the main thread but I came across the following game played between two juniors [neither is known to me so I have no vested interest] where I include Stockfish annotations. Before White could even consider Nf5, Lichess decided s/he was cheating. I'm simply curious - can anyone explain why?

1e4 c5
2 Nf3 g6
3 d4 cxd
4 Nxd4 Nf6
5 Nc3 d6
6 Be3 Bg7
7 Bc4? [Mistake. f3 was best] Nc6?! [Inaccuracy. Ng4 was best]
8 f3 Qb6
0-1
Cheat detected, Black is victorious

Jacob Ward
Posts: 27
Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 9:20 am

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Jacob Ward » Sat Nov 21, 2020 2:18 pm

I think that Lichess will flag it as cheating immediately if it can see you have a Lichess analysis board open with the same position, so that is one possibility. I have heard (unconfirmed) that there have been false positives where another person is looking at the position from the same IP, although I have done that with no issues.

Wadih Khoury
Posts: 247
Joined: Sun Jul 12, 2020 8:14 pm

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Wadih Khoury » Sat Nov 21, 2020 3:46 pm

Yes that is my understanding. If it detects an analysis board open with the same position as the game, from the same machine (or IP?), then lichess stops the game.
The individual is not necessarily tagged as a cheater by the way.

User avatar
JustinHorton
Posts: 8272
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:06 am
Location: Somewhere you're not

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by JustinHorton » Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:02 am

Meanwhile in Lancaster
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

lostontime.blogspot.com

Roger de Coverly
Posts: 19271
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 2:51 pm

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Roger de Coverly » Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:56 am

JustinHorton wrote:
Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:02 am
Meanwhile
I see a defence quoted as "a friend was using the account". That's not much of a defence really as it would certainly be cheating to send a substitute to compete in an OTB event.

User avatar
Michael Farthing
Posts: 1968
Joined: Fri Apr 04, 2014 1:28 pm
Location: Morecambe, Europe

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Michael Farthing » Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:13 pm

Well he certainly had no need to cheat in his last graded OTB game - the rubbishy play of his opponent made that quite unnecessary.

Colin Purdon
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Mar 13, 2013 12:45 pm

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Colin Purdon » Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:26 pm

Is there chess software that runs the same algorithm used by Ken Regan, so that you can put in games and it gives you the parameters than Regan uses?

I know that online sites such as lichess and software such as Lucas Chess give an average centipawn value and an Elo rating derived from that value, but I am not sure if they are using method and/or tables that Regan uses. For example, do they apply the rule that if the centipawn evaluation for a particular position is >300 then that move is ignored for the purposes of calculating average centipawn value and Elo?

This is a general question, not related to recent cases being discussed here.

John McKenna
Posts: 4395
Joined: Tue May 17, 2011 2:02 pm

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by John McKenna » Sun Nov 22, 2020 6:03 pm

For what Ken Regan had to say see -

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=10832&p=245597&hili ... an#p245598

This alternative (PGN-Spy) has been tried but, I believe, proved problematical -

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=10929&p=248806&hilit=pgnspy#p248806
To find a for(u)m that accommodates the mess, that is the task of the artist now. (Samuel Beckett)

Martin Benjamin
Posts: 268
Joined: Sun Oct 28, 2007 8:54 pm

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Martin Benjamin » Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:54 pm

I was very disappointed to hear from a good friend of mine that lichess had restricted his activity because of "violations" which they will not specify. My friend is honest and I know he would not cheat. Like me, he plays some online blitz for fun, and has not played any serious chess online. I also have an account on chess.com, where I play some arena blitz, and looking at my notifications, I see a mounting number of occasions where I have been awarded rating points because my opponent has "violated fair play policy". I don't know whether this is an indication of a considerable number of people cheating or false positives (or a combination of both).

If someone wants to cheat against me in a blitz arena, let them, if they gain satisfaction from winning that way. I really don't care (different matter in "serious" chess, of course). However, it is irritating when my friend gets restricted from playing for fun. He could create a new account, but it must irk to have your integrity questioned.

User avatar
JustinHorton
Posts: 8272
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:06 am
Location: Somewhere you're not

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by JustinHorton » Mon Nov 23, 2020 9:25 am

Martin Benjamin wrote:
Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:54 pm
I was very disappointed to hear from a good friend of mine that lichess had restricted his activity because of "violations" which they will not specify.
Are you able to tell us any more about what you mean by "restricted"?
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

lostontime.blogspot.com

Jacob Ward
Posts: 27
Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 9:20 am

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Jacob Ward » Mon Nov 23, 2020 10:14 am

I apologise for lowering the tone of this very interesting thread, but I cannot help saying that every time I see one of Justin's posts I am amused by the juxtaposition of his strong (and to my mind entirely fair) views on cheating and his post signature!

User avatar
JustinHorton
Posts: 8272
Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:06 am
Location: Somewhere you're not

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by JustinHorton » Mon Nov 23, 2020 11:58 am

It's rendered slightly differently in the novel, by the way.
Stok rolled the cigar across his mouth and said, "Buyer watch out," a couple of times. I just drank the lemon tea and said nothing. Stok ambled across to the chessboard on the side-table, his leather coat creaking like a windjammer.

"Are you a chess player, English?" he said.

"I prefer games where there's a better chance to cheat," I said.
I have a preference for the film version, which I'd link to if I could locate the right clip.
"Do you play chess?"
"Yes, but I prefer a game with a better chance of cheating."

lostontime.blogspot.com

Martin Benjamin
Posts: 268
Joined: Sun Oct 28, 2007 8:54 pm

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Martin Benjamin » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:43 pm

JustinHorton wrote:
Mon Nov 23, 2020 11:58 am
It's rendered slightly differently in the novel, by the way.
Stok rolled the cigar across his mouth and said, "Buyer watch out," a couple of times. I just drank the lemon tea and said nothing. Stok ambled across to the chessboard on the side-table, his leather coat creaking like a windjammer.

"Are you a chess player, English?" he said.

"I prefer games where there's a better chance to cheat," I said.
I have a preference for the film version, which I'd link to if I could locate the right clip.
My favourite line from the film is where the German waiter approaches Harry Palmer in the nightclub and asks "Bitte, mein Herr?" to which Palmer replies "No, Lowenbrau".

Martin Benjamin
Posts: 268
Joined: Sun Oct 28, 2007 8:54 pm

Re: Cheating in chess

Post by Martin Benjamin » Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:58 pm

JustinHorton wrote:
Mon Nov 23, 2020 9:25 am
Martin Benjamin wrote:
Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:54 pm
I was very disappointed to hear from a good friend of mine that lichess had restricted his activity because of "violations" which they will not specify.
Are you able to tell us any more about what you mean by "restricted"?
No rated games, unable to join tournaments or receive challenges. Maybe some other features that he has yet to explore are also off limits. He doesn't care about the rating per se, but most players of his standard (circa 1900) want to play rated games.

Post Reply