London Central YMCA (aka CentYMCA) Chess Club

[Daryl Taylor]

This was many years before the Internet, at a time when the standard for the intellectual and scholarly quality of a quizmaster was set by Bamber Gascoigne. The chap we had that year was more like Gazza Gascoigne in this respect.

Yes, this was one of those annual inter-YMCA events, with several sports and games included. CentYMCA always won the chess very comfortably, and we came to regard this aspect of the competition as a bit of a joke. I recall playing at Dartford and also at the Indian YMCA (a short walk from our home base). I also have a dim recollection that our team at Dartford one year was George Dickson, Andrew Martin, Yours Truly and a very young William Watson.

I'm also fairly sure that the event was held at CentYMCA at least once during my sojourn, as the quizmaster asked me to provide some popular classical music clips. Ian R Watson was on our team and correctly identified Mozart's Horn Concerto No. 4 in Eb major.

[Daryl Taylor]

When is somebody going to tell the story of the splendid practical joke played on GV Soma Peiris at the Endell Street building by a certain Mr Murphy, editor of the fictitious Camden Journal, and a young reporter called Simon Smith?

[Michael Jones]

Thank you Malcolm! Les Osborne was our other YMCA governor. I always got the impression that he was intellectually highly capable, but prone to serious bouts of depression.

Again Andrew may remember the details of the Egg Head Quiz contest held at Dartford YMCA sometime during the early 80s. The quizmaster was a prime candidate for Monty Python's Upper Class Twit of the Year, and one of the questions concerned the Turkish army officer who became the country's first President. Les was first to the buzzer with the answer Kemal Atatürk, whereas the answer on the quizmaster's card was Mustafa Kemal. Les was absolutely furious that his answer was not accepted:

That is not the answer on the card.

But IT'S THE SAME PERSON!

That is not the answer on the card.

That's why it always helps, as a quizmaster, to have some knowledge of the subject rather than just to be reading out questions and answers parrot-fashion (not always possible, admittedly, if the quiz covers a variety of fairly arcane subjects). I recall Bamber Gascoigne saying that he used to be given the questions for a programme a day or two in advance of filming, and would spend the intervening time checking them himself (with an encyclopedia, of course - as Daryl says, those were the pre-Internet days). As a UC almost-veteran (I was reserve for our team, and in the audience during the matches) I can confirm that current practice, if there's any doubt as to whether a given answer is correct, is for the clock to be stopped while someone goes off to check it.

[Richard James]

Someone I forgot to mention was, in posts acknowledging positive contributions to chess, Richard Furness,
former BCF Director of Junior Chess, having just read about his passing on, too. Richard was not a young
man when I liaised with him, so his journey beyond is not surprising, but he was one of the unsung better
people that the game benefited from. E.g., He fought elements within the BCF that tried to scotch Luke
McShane's trip abroad to play in Szombathely (even though I organized it, not the BCF) because he was
"too young", despite daddy Rod McShane accompanying him. The same nay-sayers were already wanting
to stop Luke from having anything to do with the World u-10 championship that was to happen later
in the year, and Rod swore that if the BCF bureaucrats (who are these people, anyway?) didn't get out
of the way, then Luke would become Australian for chess purposes (daddy Rod was Australian). The rest
is history, as Luke had a great trip and went on to the world u-10 to win it.

Hi George. It's good to see you on here.

All this is perfectly true.

My understanding was that the BCF selectors voted 3-2 in favour of Luke being selected for the World U-10 Championship, and that those against were the EPSCA people. In later years I saw many other examples of the parochialism of those involved in running this organization. Their reason was that a year or two earlier a young boy had had a bad experience in the World U-10s, having been unable to cope emotionally with some poor results. Of course you have to take this sort of thing into account when selecting young players for major events, but everyone who knew Luke at this time was aware that he was very strong emotionally as well as being an exceptional player. Rod also told me that Luke would have changed his chess nationality to Australian if he hadn't been selected.

[George Szaszvari]

My understanding was that the BCF selectors voted 3-2 in favour of Luke being selected for the World U-10 Championship, and that those against were the EPSCA people. In later years I saw many other examples of the parochialism of those involved in running this organization. Their reason was that a year or two earlier a young boy had had a bad experience in the World U-10s, having been unable to cope emotionally with some poor results. Of course you have to take this sort of thing into account when selecting young players for major events, but everyone who knew Luke at this time was aware that he was very strong emotionally as well as being an exceptional player. Rod also told me that Luke would have changed his chess nationality to Australian if he hadn't been selected.

Hi, Richard, all this figures...how is Rod these days?

[Richard James]

My understanding was that the BCF selectors voted 3-2 in favour of Luke being selected for the World U-10 Championship, and that those against were the EPSCA people. In later years I saw many other examples of the parochialism of those involved in running this organization. Their reason was that a year or two earlier a young boy had had a bad experience in the World U-10s, having been unable to cope emotionally with some poor results. Of course you have to take this sort of thing into account when selecting young players for major events, but everyone who knew Luke at this time was aware that he was very strong emotionally as well as being an exceptional player. Rod also told me that Luke would have changed his chess nationality to Australian if he hadn't been selected.

Hi, Richard, all this figures...how is Rod these days?

He's currently living in Folkestone. We haven't been in touch for a couple of years.

[Malcolm Clarke]

Back to the subject of quizzes, a subject that Daryl Taylor and Michael Jones have mentioned, I think certain key principles are the same, whether we are in the encyclopedia age or internet age.

When providing the questions I have always endeavoured to ensure that

1) For each question I where possible, use a second source to confirm my answer.
2) The information is up to date on the day of the quiz.
3) To try and avoid ambiguous questions.

On the subject of YMCA chess which Daryl has raised, I think the inter-YMCA competition became a lot more even, with Mike Wills using a variety of players. I can remember Polish YMCA whose top board was graded 181 winning it. All the other YMCA's had players who featured in the London League, and when I organised my own team to play against the German YMCA I played against Ian Coker on top board.

Also on the subject of the YMCA, Rod Cullum whose name has been mentioned on this forum, in fact died last year.

[Daryl Taylor]

On the subject of YMCA chess which Daryl has raised, I think the inter-YMCA competition became a lot more even, with Mike Wills using a variety of players. I can remember Polish YMCA whose top board was graded 181 winning it. All the other YMCA's had players who featured in the London League, and when I organised my own team to play against the German YMCA I played against Ian Coker on top board.

Also on the subject of the YMCA, Rod Cullum whose name has been mentioned on this forum, in fact died last year.

Why do I get the impression that you are still involved in YMCA affairs? In my own time in London I was a Corporate Member and also involved with the Young Members Forum and various other National Council activities.

[Malcolm Clarke]

Perhaps because since London Central YMCA has been discussed here, I have been into their website to see what is currently happening there.

I was only a member of the YMCA for a comparatively short time, and am so relaying the memories of it that stick in my mind the most vividly.

[George Szaszvari]

...and that those against were the EPSCA people. In later years I saw many other examples of the parochialism of those involved in running this organization.

This fits in with experiences I had. Since I was coaching at a couple of primary schools, besides a prep school, etc,
I wanted to go to some meetings of English Primary Schools Chess Assoc organizers to at least see what was going
on and perhaps combine efforts with other junior chess organizations and include memberships from across the great
private v state school class warfare divide to join each others' school team playing leagues, etc. One EPSCA meeting
I planned to make I simply couldn't get to in time because of a busy coaching schedule, limited resources and traffic
issues. At that time I traveled everywhere with public transport. The vast and convoluted area of SE London (where
I needed to navigate for most of this stuff) was served mainly by bus and some surface British Rail lines, with little,
if any, Underground rail lines. The regularity of some of these services could be unfortunately infrequent, and the
cancellations exasperatingly frequent... anyway, despite explaining this later to a couple of the teachers I knew
(primary school teachers generally made up these organizing committees) they simply said they decided that I was
obviously not serious enough about my proposed ideas to be at the meeting and had voted unanimously, there and
then, to focus their energies on playing with themselves ;0)

I soon learned that a bicycle was the way to get around and managed to get to a subsequent meeting, iirc an AGM,
to make up for the previous mishap, but found out it was a mistake. The members sat around laughing and talking
about their successes, with defiantly surly looks thrown in my direction, and after some time of this I simply told them
they "had a wonderful mutual back slapping society" and departed with a volley of psychic daggers flying in my direction.
Not one of my most tactful moves, but I had a habit of blurting out things like that, whether fair or not, since the
reactions one could get were often priceless! I have since grown up and learned not to do that any more, unless
strictly warranted with predictable repercussions :0) A lot of the EPSCA people (not all) seemed to see themselves
as revolutionary heroes fighting a class war on behalf of their under privileged students, and that someone like me,
working at a fee paying prep school, was the Enemy of the People. Little did those smart arses know that I was brought
up in poverty from a broken family, lived in some pretty derelict housing a lot of the time, went to state secondary
school and couldn't afford to go to art college as I should have done...(sounds of heartrendingly sad violin music)...

Despite the God Almighty hard headed politburo style attitudes within EPSCA, it has to be admitted that they still did
a lot of good work, too, one example being the early help and opportunities they gave to a young Joe Gallagher, now
a successful IGM living in Schweiz.






.

[Malcolm Clarke]

At a chess tournament dinner I went to last week, one person mentioned the name of Matthew Sadler, who was certainly at one stage one of the three or four best players in the country.

I recall Matthew Sadler being a junior player with London Central YMCA in the 1980's, although I am not sure how often he represented the club. Other players who represented the YMCA during my association with the club that reached grandmaster status were William Watson and Dharshan Kumaran.

I also understand that Julian Hodgson was also a former player with the club, and I am sure those who begun their association with the club earlier than myself could identify other players representing the YMCA who have achieved the grandmaster title. However I do not think that Stewart Haslinger can be included on this list, as although his father, sister and brother played, he was still quite young at the time, the name was switched from London Central YMCA to London Central.

As Daryl Taylor has replied to a couple of my posts, and I know he now lives in Finland, he may be interested to know that a Finnish player graded in the 170's, Juha Nevalainen played for my current chess club Eastleigh Rail from 1996 to 2003.
Juha was at the time working for IBM (Winchester) and he now I believe works for IBM (Finland) having returned to his home country.. While in England he played an important part in my team moving from division 3 to division 1 of the Southampton Chess League.

Obviously I am aware that even allowing for the fact that Finland has a smaller population than the United Kingdom, that living in the same country hardly suggests they are likely to know each other, I thought there was no harm in mentioning this.

[Daryl Taylor]

No, I don't think we've met. Juha plays for a club called Nurmijärven shakkikerho (NurmSK). They are neighbours in a sense to my club, Etelä-Vantaan shakkikerho (EtVaS), insofar as that's the next chess club that you find after ours if you are travelling from Helsinki to Tampere. They are about 20 miles up the main road from us.

Juha's current Finnish elo rating is 1945, which is roughly equal to BCF 168.

[George Szaszvari]

I recall Matthew Sadler being a junior player with London Central YMCA in the 1980's, although I am not sure how often he represented the club. Other players who represented the YMCA during my association with the club that reached grandmaster status were William Watson and Dharshan Kumaran.
I also understand that Julian Hodgson was also a former player with the club, and I am sure those who begun their association with the club earlier than myself could identify other players representing the YMCA who have achieved the grandmaster title. However I do not think that Stewart Haslinger can be included on this list, as although his father, sister and brother played, he was still quite young at the time, the name was switched from London Central YMCA to London Central.

I don't recall Sadler as a member, perhaps because he was there when I wasn't during one of my escapades abroad,
while I know that Hodgson and Kumaran were there for a short time as juniors (probably because Leonard Barden
advised their parents,) and Willy Watson and the Haslinger family were certainly long time regulars, from the old
days to being at the new building when the club folded/transmogrified.

Other London CentYMCA characters to recall are cigar smoking old man Ernie Szücs and his son (first name?)....
Ernie has presumably passed on, but what happened to his son? Another Hungarian was welder Laszlo Kiss (who
could do the Bishop & Knight v lone King checkmate in the shortest possible number of moves from any position),
he'll be in his 80s by now. I heard that Ilya (Gane) Bozic (a former partisan in WWII Yugoslavia, who taught me
a couple of life saving self defense tricks, and would also be in his 80s by now) of Bayswater chess club, went
to live in an ashram in India.

[Malcolm Clarke]

On the subject of Matthew Sadler I have since discovered that his name appeared on our London League nomination list for the 1984/85 season that Mike Wills submitted, although he was in the section of players who were regarded as unlikely to play (Certainly at that time it was best to register any player who had a minimal chance of playing with the league, sooner rather than later). His grade at the time was listed as 141+10.

With respect to Juha Nevalainen whom I discussed with Daryl Taylor, it is good to know that he is still playing. Towards the end of his stay with us he was finding it difficult to play because of work commitments. Probably the reason I remember him as a 170+ player is because his first three grades with us were 178, 177 and 174, and I certainly valued greatly his contribution to Eastleigh Rail chess club.

[George Szaszvari]

...cigar smoking old man Ernie Szücs and his son (first name?)....
Ernie has presumably passed on, but what happened to his son?


Aha, not yet completely senile: the first name of the younger Szücs is PAUL.